The best vanilla extract?

[bijoux22]

I have never been much of a baker, but lately I have been getting into it. I have always bought pure vanilla extract either store brand or McCormicks but have seen Mexican, Tunisian, double strength etc. at specialty stores. Does it make a difference? If so which ones can you recommend?

[Gail]

I haven't tried enough different brands to say with certainty. I will tell you what NOT to buy-- or anyway, this is my opinion. I decided to buy Cook's Cookie Vanilla (as distinguished from Cook's Vanilla, which is just dandy) Talk about cloying! Sickeningly sweet! I like vanilla but that was like swallowing up a vanilla sachet! Vanilla overload! Bleah!

...I trust I have made my point. http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/smile.gif

[Ohioan]

Yes, but Gail, you never told us whether you liked it or not. You simply must stop mincing words like that and be more straightforward! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/biggrin.gif Hee hee hee...

Phoebe

[lindrusso]

I don't know a whole lot about vanilla, but I do know that some types like Mexican can be MUCH stronger than regular vanilla. Maybe that's what happened with Cook's Cookie Vanilla??!! I've always been tempted to try one of the specialty or "gourmet" types - like Madagascar - but can't bring myself to spend the extra money. One of these days I will just to satisfy my curiosity.

[Connie]

I seem to remember reading somewhere (Cook's Illustrated, perhaps) about vanilla ratings. I think that's why I'm using Madagascar Bourbon pure vanilla extract. But then again, maybe that's not why I'm using it. It is a little pricey, but I'm worth it, as are the people that eat what I make!!

[Beth]

I've been using the Madagascar Boubon vanilla and really like it. I try to buy it at Cost Plus though, since it is less there than at the grocery store or places like WIlliams Sonoma. I have heard talk about Mexican vanilla (realtor and I saw a quart bottle in the pantry of a home we were looking at), but I'm not sure how it compares.

[Mamasue]

I switched to Madagascar Boubon vanilla years ago and love it. The pure vanilla is pricy but my baked goods are worth it! It gives off a stronger, fresher, real flavor where the extract just does not compare. I even have my mother using it now and she still lives through the "depression" years (money wise). LOL Of course, she bought her first bottle, but her darling daughters supply her with refills at Christmas time. http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/biggrin.gif

I also use anise oil versus anise extract with my italian cookie recipes. The oil is much more stronger which means you use less than what recipe calls for. If recipe calls for tablespoon then I reduce to at least one teaspoon.

[Melman]

My favorite vanilla is homemade vanilla! It has two ingredients....vanilla beans and vodka. A spice/herb dealer told me how to make it years ago. I haven't used store-bought vanilla since then.

How to make it? Buy two of the biggest and juiciest vanilla beans you can find (the vanilla beans from this particular dealer are consistently the best I've found). Buy one bottle of vodka. [Ok..I admit...I never remember what the liquor stores call this size. It's not the smallest...but maybe the next size up.] Slice the two beans lengthwise and drop them in the bottle of vodka. Close the bottle. Let it sit for about a month...turning it upside down every couple of days. After a week or so, the vodka will start to turn a "vanilla" color. Around 3 or 4 weeks, you'll have the best smelling vanilla you could ever imagine.

FYI...look at a bottle of vanilla extract. Ingredients usually include vanilla bean, alcohol, and water. Why waste perfectly wonderful vanilla by adding water!! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/wink.gif

[Shelly]

I ordered a bottle of Mexican vanilla from the King Arthur Baker's Catalogue. It is made by Nielsen-Massey. I can definitely smell the difference, but I'm not sure that I can taste the difference. I think I would have to have two of the same thing, each made with the different vanillas to be able to tell. Gail, thanks for the heads up about the cookie vanilla - I almost bought that one instead!

Melman, what a great idea! I'm going to try your homemade vanilla. Does anyone know who might have really good vanilla beans? The ones I've bought in the grocery store are the only ones I've seen, so I don't know if they are "big and juicy" or not! I know there are several mail order sources, but I've never ordered vanilla beans from any of them. As for the vodka, you must be talking about the pint size. I think the smallest size is the 1/2 pint.................... http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/smile.gif

P.S. Where can one find Madagascar Boubon vanilla?? I've never even heard of it! Thanks http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/cool.gif

[This message has been edited by Shelly (edited 09-27-2000).]

[andi]

Originally posted by Shelly:


Does anyone know who might have really good vanilla beans? The ones I've bought in the grocery store are the only ones I've seen, so I don't know if they are "big and juicy" or not! I know there are several mail order sources, but I've never ordered vanilla beans from any of them.

I make my own vanilla too using the same technique. I buy my vanilla beans at cooking specialty stores (you can find them at the good old mall!). The vodka/vanilla bottle I have is 750 ml and I don't have the brain power at this moment to convert from metrics...

[phantomcg]

Shelly and/or Andi:
Does it make a big difference on the type of vodka you use. Does the "cheap" stuff work as good as the "premium" brands?
Thanks,
Cheryl

[KimKelly]

I picked up a small bottle of vanilla when I was on vacation in Tahiti. It was mostly just as a souvenir, I think it cost about $2. As it turned out, it was the most wonderful, fantastic, tasty vanilly I have ever used! I have searched everywhere, including web searches and can not duplicate it. So, in the mean time, I mean while I wait for another Tahiti trip (mind you this may be years and years and years!) I have been using a Tahitian vanilla that I bought for a couple of dollars at Trader Joes believe it or not. It is a full, smooth flavor, not "alcoholy". I recommend this one.

Kim

[RunnerKim]

What a wonderful idea - making your own vanilla! I've been trying to come up with a creative "food" gift item for Christmas that wouldn't need to be consumed right away. This I think would sure be appreciated by those I have in mind.

Melman, please do post if you can find contact information for your "herb man".

I think a pint is about 500ml - so 750ml would be around 1.5pints or 24oz. Right?...

Can you pour the vanilla into other containers, I assume (to make a prettier gift). Also can you store it just like other vanilla, in your pantry?

Thanks!
Kim

[bijoux22]

Connie at your suggestion I bought some Madagascar Bourbon vanilla. I am going to take the cap off and do the old sniff test tonight and compare it with the store brand. Now I cant wait for the weekend to do some baking for the true test!

Shelly, I bought the vanilla at the Williams Sonoma store. I'm sure they offer it in their e-catalog also.

Melman, thanks for the recipe for home made vanilla I am going to try this also.

[This message has been edited by bijoux22 (edited 09-27-2000).]

[Connie]

bijoux22,
I have also found the Madagascar vanilla at TJ Maxx, for a lot less than Williams Somoma (which is where I found it in the first place). With all these new options, we will all be swimming in vanilla! There will also be a run on vodka at all the party stores! I like the idea of making it for gifts.
Melman,
After the vanilla is made, should it be stored in a fairly airtight container? The store-bought bottles close pretty tight. Thanks for the new easy project.

[bijoux22]

The Christmas gift idea is terrific. Now I need to know where I can buy good quality vanilla beans. Does anyone have a good source?

[Melman]

A friend of mine bought vanilla beans through Penzey's. There were PRETTY good...but still didn't compare to the vanilla beans I've purchased in the past. I'll check at home and see if I can find the name of the "herb man" (as I call him). I know he's in a small town about 30-45 miles north of Asheville, NC. I'm pretty sure they have mail-order as an option. I always buy my vanilla beans from him when he comes to a holiday show in my town every December, so I've never tried looking for an 800#, etc.

[bijoux22]

OK, I bought my vanilla beans today, now I need to know if the brand of vodka makes a difference - you know, the good stuff or the cheap stuff.

[Melman]

Ok...I finally have almost all the answers I've been trying to get.

The vanilla beans can be bought from a company called "Just Herbs". (I was wrong about them being north of Asheville...another couple bought the original business and they're now in Big Stone Gap, Virginia.) I'm trying to get their 800 number right now. As soon as I verify I have the right number, I'll post whatever info I can find on cost, etc.

I also checked my bottle of vodka. It's 375 ml...and is Smirnoff. I'm not an expert in vodka, but I'm guessing we're talking about a relatively cheap variety!! :-) I keep mine in the original bottle. The really fun part about this vanilla is that if you start running out, you just top it off with additional vodka. If the vanilla smell starts fading (we're talking MONTHS!!), just drop in another bean or two.

Yes, you can put it in one of the fancier decorator bottles. I'd just make sure it has a really tight-fitting cap or cork. I've used a variety of bottles over the years for gifts! Haven't had any complaints!

[bijoux22]

Thanks Melman, I can't wait to begin this little project this weekend. It feels good to get an early start on Christmas gifts. I usually start to think about it in November!

[RunnerKim]

Thanks for looking up this information - I too plan to get started this weekend. First step is figuring out just how much I need to make!

When you gave the little bottles as gifts - did you include a vanilla bean (or part of one) in the little bottle? (hmmm kind of like a worm in a tequila bottle?!)

I notice that the vanilla I buy in the store comes in dark bottles - is it sensitive to light? Did you use dark botttles?

On the quality of vodka - I would think it would matter as it is a major ingredient. From what I've gathered this vanilla gets better with age (like fine liquor) so the better the vodka the better the vanilla - but at what point is it noticeable to the average person, I would think as long as you avoid the stuff in plastic jugs, it'd be okay!

Kim

[AndreaU]

Here's yet another... my mom brought back some vanilla from the Caribbean. It's from Sunny Carbbee and it's called "Vanilla Vanilla" because it comes with vanilla bean in the bottle. I love it & now they're online so if mom doesn't make it to the islands, the islands can come to me! If you're interested, check them out at http://www.sunnycaribbee.com
They also sell just vanilla beans.


[This message has been edited by AndreaU (edited 09-29-2000).]

[andi]

In answer to some of the above questions: I don't think it matters what type of vodka you use-I've used several different brands and you can't tell the difference. For gifts I have used the thick glass bottles with the cork/stoppers with excellent results. You can find them at any hobby store. I place one of the whole beans in those bottles-they look beautiful as gifts. I wrap a bit of rafia around the neck along with a tag. I keep my bottle in the pantry and it takes me a good six months-one year to go through that 750ml of vanilla (unless I give it away). I've not noticed a problem with fading or with the taste changing. I've also heard of using bourbon but the report was that the flavor is too intense. Once you make your own it's hard to go back! Happy vanilla making all!

[Mary N]

have any of you tried and compared the liquid vanilla to the powder variety? the folks who make the powder stuff say that the liquid evaporates WITH the flavor when baking, thus making the powdered stuff better. i have tried the powdered variety without noticing any difference.

[bijoux22]

I hate to be so helpless, but I am on a mission to get this Christmas project going. I have the beans, I know where to buy the vodka but I can't seem to find cute little bottles with screw tops to put the finished vanilla in. Do you have any ideas or sources? Thanks!

[debg]

I think this idea is just "fab!" Can't wait to try it and easy too!

As for bottles, we have a great store called Cost Plus. They sell a variety of bottles, shapes, sizes, etc. Also, Pier One or the Container Store. I find the best selection and cheapest prices at Cost Plus!

[Melman]

After several rounds of telephone tag, here's the info on vanilla beans.

They can be purchased from Just Herbs. Toll-free number is 888-59HERBS (888-594-3727). They also have email: justherbs@yahoo.com. The owner told me they're working on a web site but it's not up-and-running quite yet.

The beans cost $2.50 each. She said shipping would probably be in the range of $2. She also said they can sell the beans by weight if anyone is thinking about making LOTS of vanilla. She sells 1/4 pound and 1/2 pound of beans at roughly $100 a pound. There are about 90 beans in a pound. (Hmmmm...around 20-22 beans for $25?? Not a bad deal if you're making lots of gifts.)

Also, I checked with her regarding some of the questions posed in earlier questions. She said she's never really noticed a difference in the vanilla regardless of the price of the vodka. She also said her preference is to use RUM for her vanilla!!

She also said the correct proportions are 2 vanilla beans to a pint of rum or vodka. A darker bottle will hold the flavor better. (I have a clear glass vodka bottle and keep it in my cabinet...no problems!!) A plastic or a glass bottle won't make a difference.

Sidenote: a friend of mine started a bottle of vanilla about 2 weeks ago. She said it's already starting to turn color from clear to "vanilla colored". She hasn't opened the bottle to see if it already smells like vanilla.

[Connie]

LisaD,
Thanks for all that info! What a complicated process to get vanilla beans!

[Lisa D]

Hey everyone! As is my penchant, I like to go to the foodtv website and get the great info they have on ingredients. As with anything vanilla is a complicated issue and this article really cleared up a lot for me. I like to use the neilsen-massey madagascar vanilla.
The vanilla bean is the fruit of an orchid (vanilla planifolia). Native to tropical America, vanilla beans were cultivated by the Aztecs. Obtaining pure vanilla begins with orchid blossoms, which open only one day a year. Because this orchid has only one natural pollinator (the Melipona bee), which cannot possibly handle the task in such a small period of time, the flower must be hand-pollinated. After pollination, pods take 6 weeks to reach full size and 8 to 9 months to mature. The mature pods, which must be hand-picked, are green and have none of the familiar vanilla flavor or fragrance. They need curing, a 3- to 6-month process that begins with a 20-second boiling-water bath followed by sun heating. Then they're wrapped in blankets and allowed to sweat. Over months of drying and sweating the beans ferment, shrinking by 400 percent and turning brown. Better grades of beans become thinly coated with white, powdery vanillin (also produced synthetically). Today, the three most common types of vanilla beans are Bourbon-Madagascar, Mexican and Tahitian. Bourbon-Madagascar vanilla beans come from Madagascar and the West Indian island of Réunion. They're rich and sweet and the thinnest type. About 75 percent of vanilla beans come from the Madagascar area. Mexican vanilla beans have a rich flavor but are scarcer than Bourbon-Madacascar beans. Some Mexican vanilla products contain coumarin (banned by the FDA), a potentially toxic substance. There's no way for the consumer to tell which Mexican vanilla products contain this, so buy from a reliable source. Tahitian vanilla beans are the thickest and darkest of the three types. They are intensely aromatic, though not as flavorful. Vanilla powder comes from whole, gound beans. Its flavor doesn't evaporate when heated as readily as vanilla extract's. Vanilla powder is available in specialty shops and through mail order. Vanilla extract is made by macerating beans in an alcohol-water solution to extract the flavor; the mixture is then aged. Richly fragrant pure vanilla extract must contain 13.35 ounces of vanilla beans per gallon during extraction and 35 percent alcohol. (There are double- and triple-strength extracts, as well as vanilla essence--so strong that only a drop or two is needed.) Products labeled "natural vanilla flavor" contain only pure vanilla extract. Imitation vanilla is composed of artificial flavorings (most of which are paper-industry by-products treated with chemicals). It often has a harsh quality and bitter aftertaste. There's no comparison between pure and artificial vanilla in flavor intensity and quality. On labels, natural vanillin describes a natural substance, whereas artificial vanillin is artificial. Vanilla flavoring is a blend of pure and imitation vanilla. In the U. S., a label that reads vanilla ice cream indicates only pure vanilla extract and/or vanilla beans, whereas vanilla-flavored ice cream may contain up to 42 percent artificial flavorings and artificial-flavored ice cream contains only imitation flavorings. Vanilla extracts can be stored indefinitely if sealed airtight and kept in a cool, dark place. Vanilla beans should be wrapped tightly in plastic wrap, placed in an airtight jar and refrigerated. They can be stored in this manner for about 6 months. In order for its flavor not to dissipate, vanilla extract should be added to cooked mixtures after they've briefly cooled. To use vanilla beans, slit lengthwise and scrape out the thousands of seeds. These seeds can be added directly to foods such as ice-cream mixtures, shortening for pastry dough, sauces, etc. Vanilla extract can be made by placing a split bean in a jar containing 3/4 cup vodka, sealing and letting stand for 6 months. Whole beans used to flavor sauces or other mixtures may be rinsed, dried and stored for reuse.

--Copyright (c) 1995 by Barron's Educational Series, from The New Food Lover's Companion, Second Edition, by Sharon Tyler Herbst

[CL Fan]

Thanks for the great info - I love vanilla extract. I brought some back from Mexico years ago & it was wonderful.

Just to clarify on the homemade extract - do you remove the beans after it sits for a month or leave the beans in?

[RunnerKim]

My understanding is that you leave them in - some directions call for it sitting up to 6 months (I don't have that kind of patience!) - and people talk about just topping off the jar with additional vodka, which would require the beans still be in there.

Kim

[Adriana]

What a great thread! I have a book entitled The El Paso Chili Company Rum & Tiki Cookbook which recommends using rum instead of vodka for your vanilla extract. The proportions are different than mentioned in previous postes. They recommend:

5 whole vanilla beans
1 cup best-quality gold rum

Split the vanilla beans lengthwise, then halve them crosswise. Combine with the rum, cover and soak for 2 weeks, shaking occasionally.

Now, about that source for vanilla beans, please?

[debg]

melman,

Thanks for getting the info. I've ordered some from Penzeys and will see how they are. Also just found them at Trader Joes for 2 beans/$3.50. I just didn't realize they were that expensive! I think Penzeys was 15 beans for around $25. Didn't realize what monsters you'd create with that post, did ya??!!

[bijoux22]

I "started" my vanilla tonight! Has anyone else begun yet?

[RunnerKim]

I just started mine last night too. I had to track down a liquor store (recently moved to the NW where there only seems to be state-owned liquor stores, only wine and beer in the grocery stores).

I ended up buying 2 750ml vodka bottles - originally planned to get 1 smaller size. Ended up putting 3 beans in each, I'd planned to do 4 in the 750 and 2 in the 350. I think it'll be fine as its almost 3 months until Christmas (although I won't be able to wait that long to sample it). Still have to buy my bottles though.

Bijoux22 - what did you decide to do? I was tempted to try a small one with brandy to do a comparison.

Kim

[bijoux22]

RunnerKim, I used a pint bottle of Smirnoff and 2 6" beans. I thought I might try the rum also. I am still looking for bottles, I keep finding 8oz size, but I am looking for something smaller.

I thought that I would take the dry ingredients for a cookie recipe (like tollhouse or M&M) layer it in a mason jar, tie the recipe on with cute ribbon, package it with a cookie sheet, maybe a hot mitt and the vanilla. I thought it might make a great gift, I know I would love to receive it as a gift! Any other ideas

[phantomcg]

I started my vanilla on Saturday and it was already beginning to change color by Monday. I used the 750 ml bottle and I had a package from Penzey's with 4 beans in it, so I used them all. Now I think I'm going to have to try the rum recipe as well!!!

Cheryl

[MaryH]

I mentioned this to my sister in law and now I have to start some too as she says she loves vanilla. On a related note, you can also use the vanilla beans (if you have extra) by slicing them open and putting them in an airtight container full of sugar. This will make what is known as vanilla sugar. It is great for cookies. (I use it in a recipe I have for white chocolate chunk/dried cherry cookies.)

[Connie]

MaryH,
Could you share your cookie recipe? As if I don't have enough already! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/wink.gif Thanks!

[RunnerKim]

I was thinking about collecting a few recipes that highlight vanilla - sugar cookies comes to mind and including them with the vanilla. Maybe an eggnog recipe considering the season. i'd really like to find a variety - seems like I recall a pork recipe with a vanilla glaze in issues past (I just started getting them in Jan). Anyone else have thoughts?

Ed posted on the Non-fat dry milk thread a cocoa mix recipe and suggests adding vanilla to the Hot Cocoa - so maybe that would be a neat additional gift too. So many options!

Kim

[MaryH]

Connie,

I'll look for it and post it if I find it. (I'm one of those recipe cutters who probably needs a better organizing system - although this one is - hopefully still - with all my Christmas cookie recipes.) FYI - I know that I cut it out of the LA Times but that was probably at least a few years ago.

mary

[debg]

You'd think I would have the message by now, but one quick question, did you slice the vanilla beans before you put them into the alcohol? Did you cut all the way through or just slice part way??? Thanks! I'm planning to start mine this weekend! I'm a teacher and always looking for inexpensive yet useful gifts for mom helpers and staff!
I've got a good one this year...YIPPEE!!!

[bijoux22]

I cut mine in half and then down the middle, I don't know if it is THE way, but it seems to be working so far. It has been 2 days and I can already smell vanilla!

RunnerKim, Excellent idea to include recipes that contain vanilla. We are all going to look so clever at holiday time, and might I add smug knowing we got a little jump start. Thanks for sharing your great ideas!

[Beth]

For some other ideas on things to put in gift baskets, check out Kelly's post on looking for things layered in jars. You might pick up some recipes or inspirations there.

[Ed]

Hi,

Bijoux22 asked if any of the rest of us have started making our own Vanilla, I did.

Went to the liquor store and bought a pint of Vodka, Karkov brand. I was surprised to see on the lable when I got it home that it's made in a town just 35 miles from here. Didn't know they had a distillerey there, Shows that I need to get more active so I know more about what's going on.

Well anyway I cut two Vanilla beans in half lengthwise and put them in the bottle. This was Tuesday evening and by yesterday evening, (Wed), it had already started to turn color.

I do believe though that when it is done it will need to be strained through some cheese cloth to get all the debris from the Vanilla beans out of the Vanilla. What do you folks think about doing that?

It was mentioned about a cookie recipe that used or features Vanilla. Well the following Cookie recipe is one I really like. My 7 year old grandson thinks this is a great cookie too, and he asked if we could make some when he got home from school yesterday so we did. He likes to help me cook and I like it when he does.

Sour Cream Sugar Cookies

1 1/2 cups sugar
1 cup Margarine. (Note: Margarine works best with this cookie, I like to use Land O Lakes, but you need to use a good brand)
2 Eggs
1 Cup Sour Cream (or Buttermilk although I always use sour cream)
3 3/4 cups flour
2 teaspoons baking powder
1 teaspoon baking soda
1 teaspoon vanilla

Cream sugar and margarine.
Add Eggs and beat well.
Add sour cream, the dry ingredients, and vanilla and mix thoroughly. Drop by teaspoons full onto greased cookie sheet.

Sprinkle some sugar on top of each cookie and if you want to you can put 1/2 or 1/4 of a candied colored (green, red, or whatever) cherry on the top too.

Bake at 375°F for 8 to 10 minutes.
Remove to wire cooling rack to cool.

These are a real good cake like Sugar Cookie with a nice Vanilla smell to them.

I like to use a small scoop instead of a teaspoon to drop them on the cookie sheet because the size is more consistent. Doing it this way should get you about 7 to 8 dozen cookies.

Please excuse me for preaching about what kind of Margarine to use, but I have a reason. I've learned that when you melt the less expensive Margarine in a measuring cup in the Microwave there is more water in that melted margarine than in the more expensive brands. I found this out when I bought some of the lower priced stuff and it threw my recipe off. So now I just use Land O Lakes.

You nice people on this BB are so much better at cooking than I am you probably knew all about that already, but I just had to explain myself.

I'm told this is based on an old order Amish Recipe, I do know this cookie is definetly worth making.

Ed

[lorilei]

Those cookies look great, Ed. And (just from looking) they remind me of a recipe that my grandmother used to use at Chrismas time.

Thanks!
Any cookie that showcases vanilla is just fine by me!

[MaryH]

I'll add a plug for Cost Plus. I found a big selection of bottles there - from big ones to smaller ones - great for this type of thing. Also, they carry vanilla beans in the food section. It was $2.79 for 2 madagascar bourbon beans.

[bijoux22]

Ed, my vanilla is starting to darken but also has little floaty things in it. I think that I will have to be strained through cheese cloth when it is finished brewing. I bought a few more beans today and am going to try the rum version also.

[RunnerKim]

I bought my bottles at CostPlus this weekend - several 2oz and 4oz varieties.

I tried posting last week but it didn't work - I also have floaties in mine and will need to strain it.

Kim

[Melman]

I've been using homemade vanilla for quite a few years. I've never strained out the floaties. When you pour the vanilla, the floaties tend to stay at the back of the bottle. I also keep remembering that really good store-bought vanilla icecream usually has flecks of vanilla bean in it...so I don't worry if a fleck or two floats into whatever I'm making. I've never ever seen a vanilla speck in anything I've made.

PS...that cookie recipe a few replies back sounds wonderful!!! Can't wait to try it!!!