Need advice (sorry, a bit long)

[ggs830]

I need advice talking to DH about a delicate situation involving my ILs.

We have two children, DD (almost 2), and DS (8 months). My ILs (MIL, SFIL, SIL, and a host of other extended family members) don't see the children very often. Maybe once a month, sometimes twice, at the most. The visits are often very short and/or there are other relatives around, so the actual time that MIL/SFIL/SIL spend with the children is limited. The bottom line is that DD and DS don't know my ILs very well, and that they are, in essence, basically strangers.

DD is generally a very friendly and interactive child, but she usually needs about 5-10 minutes to warm up when faced with a new situation or new people. DS is still a babe, but at the moment, he has pretty strong stranger anxiety, and generally only wants me or DH to hold him, especially when he is fussy.

Here's the problem: the ILs (particularly MIL) will, without fail, grab DD and DS as soon as we walk in the door, refuse to let go of them despite their cries, and force hugs and kisses on them, causing one or both of them to freak out. Yesterday was a classic example: DD sobbed for about 10 minutes because MIL carried her off to another room and refused to put her down until I physically took DD from her.

DH and I have discussed in the past about respecting our children's wishes with regards to giving/receiving affection. Basically, we agreed that we wouldn't force DD and DS to hug and kiss anyone, including family members, and that hugs and kisses would only be given if they are willing.

However, when confronted with an actual situation where one of the kids (usually DD, who is talking now) is making it clear that they don't want to be touched, DH does nothing. Instead, he makes comments like "you're okay" or "she just wants to give you a kiss", or something similar, until DD or DS begins crying, which is when he will intervene. By that time, it's usually too late, and we end up having to deal with a meltdown.

This really really bothers me. Not just because DD or DS gets upset unnecessarily, but also because I don't like the message it sends to them: that it's okay for an unfamiliar adult to grab you and kiss you, even if you protest, or that daddy will stand by and let it happen.

I've talked to the ILs about giving the kids a few minutes to warm up in order to prevent meltdowns (which happen at just about every visit), but so far it hasn't made any difference. So, I have to talk to DH, who I am pretty sure will be defensive and upset and feel like I'm attacking his family.

Any advice on how to approach DH with this gently and in a non-accusatory manner? I don't want this to get sidetracked into a "why don't you like my family" argument***, because I think this is a real and legitimate issue. Especially with holidays and birthdays coming up, we will be seeing the ILs alot more than usual.

TIA!

***In the interest of full disclosure, I have to admit that I have other issues with my ILs, particularly MIL, and those issues are no doubt affecting my feelings on this matter. Feel free to tell me if you think so.

[Robyn1007]

I have a couple of thoughts on this but all come from experience with kids with coaching or my own childhood. Yes, I think your feelings regarding your ILs are affecting your view on this. For many families seeing each other a couple times a month is way more than normal. I saw my grandparents, if lucky, once a year. I have family nearby that I love dearly that I'm lucky if I see them once a month, that's just how life goes.

I'm guessing that your kids are sensing your tension and feelings toward the ILs and that's why they are freaking out. Do you try to get them excited when the ILs are coming or do you talk in a manner like "Oh, boy, the ILs are coming, this is going to be really bad" around the kids so they feel like they should react poorly?

Now, that being said. If you and DH have discussed boundaries and he's not following through to set those boundaries with his family then you do need to discuss that part. Unfortunately, I'm not sure you can separate the issue from his family unless he does this when the kids freak out about other strangers.

Good luck, any way you look at it, it's not an easy situation.

[ChristyMarie]

This really really bothers me. Not just because DD or DS gets upset unnecessarily, but also because I don't like the message it sends to them: that it's okay for an unfamiliar adult to grab you and kiss you, even if you protest, or that daddy will stand by and let it happen.

Perhaps a letter to them in advance, stating this concept, would help? Something that states it is for the child's SAFETY. I mean, how can they argue with that? Honestly that is the reason DS will NEVER be forced to go to someone.

My inlaws are the same exact way. Why people don't understand that children are people with feelings is beyond me. Our solution is to wear DS at the beginning of any gathering. People will not take him out of a sling. Especially my wrap because it looks so complicated.;) Then, once he has warmed up he gets down and does whatever he wants. Of course, DS is rather vocal so anyone trying to force him to do anything is instantly the center of negative attention.:p

I do think that DH not respecting your wishes AND your child's feelings is an issue that needs to be addressed if you want to see any real progress though.

HTH

[SusanMac]

If your kids see your ILs once a month, then they are definitely not strangers. Even the 2 y.o. is in a position to recognize/remember them on a regular basis. Once a month is quite often, really.

With that said, tho, I totally agree that your ILs need to be more sensitive to how your kids react.

How you laid this out to us seems to be a fine way to bring it up w/DH, as well. You've both already discussed it in the past, so it won't be a new issue. Make sure you start with how it makes you feel and your concern over your kids' growth. It can't be about 'you said you'd do this...but when it happens you do this.' That would only make him defensive. Yes, the IL issue will come up, I think, no matter how you approach it.

[Grace]

I agree with Robyn. I see my nephew maybe twice a year, tops (they live in Pittsburgh, we live in Chicago. He's not even 5 yet. My sister didn't adopt him until he was 15 months old. So he's seen me in person maybe 5 times total). He knows me. I am not a "stranger". While I personally would never force a child to hug and kiss me if they were crying and fussing and wanting to get away, I have never had that reaction from children who are in my family (except for a 6 mo. old baby, which, some babies are just that way). But as a child, I always went running to everyone who came in, and all the kids I know have come running to me, so I think it is likely your attitude towards your MIL that your child is picking up on. Probably also your expression when you see them struggling to get away from their grandparent. Kids pick up on that BIG TIME. I also agree with helping them get excited about the IL's visits. They will totally take their cues from you.

Unless you have reason to believe your IL's are child molesters, teaching them to be "wary" of their grandparents (you refer to them as "unfamiliar adults??? They are their grandparents!) seems very odd to me.

[leebee]

I really don't think it's that unusual for a young child to NOT want to hug & kiss people. My children, who are the most affectionate of children, have both gone through periods where they are wary of people. My daughter, who is a couple of weeks shy of 3, will not hug/kiss her grandmother (my MIL). The more we would try to "force" it, the worse it got. We see them at least once a week. So, I spoke to my MIL about it, assured her that DD talks about her all the time, but is just going through a phase--MIL laughed and said she understood, and would give her some space. She speaks to her grandmother and blows kisses all the time, but won't get within hugging distance. It's lasted the better part of a year, but last week she ran up on her own and gave Grandma a quick hug as we were leaving the house. Once she is a little older, I will expect her to give appropriate greetings. My son (he's 6) will, even when he's not in the mood, go up & hug his grandparents upon entering & leaving their homes. Toddlers are notoriously willful. The more they realize they have control of a situation, the more entrenched they may become. The OP may have issues with her ILs to work out, but I certainly wouldn't force my very young children into a situation that likely is very fearful for them. I would, however, have an open, frank discussion, and ask that they give the kids a little time--perhaps substituting blown kisses or "high fives" as a starting point.

[ggs830]

Just to clarify a few things:

Perhaps the children are picking up on my feelings for the ILs, but I am not teaching them to be "wary" of them at all. We talk about grandma and grandpa and Aunt ___ and Uncle ___, etc. ALL the time. We look at family pictures, and DD can name just about everyone by sight. When we are getting ready to visit them, DH and I both talk it up, and DD is generally pretty excited to visit them. The problem is more that while she is excited, she also gets overwhelmed (understandably) when 2 or 3 adults **who she does not see that often** descend on her, talking in loud voices, all trying to touch her. As I said in my OP, if given the chance to warm up on her own, she is fine with the ILs, and will ask them to play on her own.

Maybe "stranger" was the wrong word to use. However, IMO, I would absolutely not accept a toddler to be comfortable right off the bat with adults that she only sees a twice a month (at most) for a couple of hours.

[clairea]

I would guess there is something going on besides your kids not being familiar with your ILs. My kids see (and saw, when they were the same age as your kids) both sets of grandparents much less frequently, and did not have any trouble remembering them. Perhaps your own tension is rubbing off on your kids, perhaps your ILs are too overbearing for your children, or maybe (although unless this happens in *every* situation with people you see with the same frequency, I think it is unlikely) both of your children really do suffer from an unusual degree of stranger anxiety. If I had to guess, I would say it is some combination of the three.

I'm not at all unsympathetic to your plight, as I have spent years talking with my DH about problems we both perceive with his parents, only to watch him stand by silently once his parents are actually in the room. I can perhaps offer the perspective of experience. I suggest you keep bringing it up calmly with DH before a family gathering (so you are not upset about what just happened), and focus on the real issues (you want your children to be comfortable, they will actually take to his parents and SIL better if allowed to go at their own pace, and you don't want to ever send the message that forced physical affection is okay). Also, try to remember that these really are short episodes in your children's lives, and while they are distressing they are unlikely to cause any significant harm. It sounds like your inlaws, while seriously misguided, are well-intentioned.

A final word of encouragement -- my kids are now 10 and 7 (so we've been doing this IL thing for a while). We had a typical episode this weekend where I told my children something, FIL and SMIL went in my children's rooms and began contradicting me to them (this is typical) - making the kids more and more upset. DH told FIL and SMIL to leave the kids alone, then about 20 minutes later actually came to me and said "see, when everyone did what you said, everything was fine." SO there is hope that one day DH will really open his eyes. I think he probably supports you now but is in a tough position having to stand up to his parents. It is easy to say "he should put his wife and kids first" but in my experience the very kinds of parents who make the spouse and kids miserable are the ones who are most likely to overreact if their child stands up to them about it. I know for DH and I this has been a real issue, because it is a very likely possiblity that he would lose all contact with his family if he pushes to hard on standing up to them. You have to pick your battles, KWIM?

[ChristyMarie]

I'm guessing many of you have been given children who are just really social right from the start. But some form of stranger anxiety is totally normal at this age. My little guy is the most social man on the planet, once he has a chance to warm up to a new situation. It takes him about 5-10 minutes. He likes to be held, look around, kinda take it all in then he'll squirm to get down and be off and running. But if you rush him, oh my, it does not go well and it will take an hour or more to get back on track.

The OP sounds like she knows her children, knows their feelings and is very in tune with what they need from her and from new situations in order to feel comfortable and secure. I think she should be proud of that and proud for standing up for her children's feelings instead of pacifying adults who should know better than to put their need for instant gratification ahead of a scared child.

[Loremma]

As someone who was an EXTREMELY shy child around adults, I would have dreaded visits with anyone who would pick me up and try to kiss me no matter who they were. "I can see you just fine from here, keep your distance!" You may just have to be more vocal when they come in if your husband won't/can't speak up for your children. Something along the lines of, "DD just woke up from a nap and is quite cranky" or "DD is in a mood, give her some space" or even "DD is not up to company at the moment, give her some time"--which is true.

You need to speak up for your children even if it is their grandparents. Your daughter is telling you, but you have to act. I hope you can resolve it with no hurt feelings.

[MrsReber]

Both of my children were and still are a bit shy around people- even ones that they know very well. DD loves my brother, but she's very shy when she's first around him. It takes some time to warm up. He does not rush her or my son and they eventually want to play with him and talk to him.

However, my IL's are another story. I clearly remember MIL telling DD when she was 3 months old "don't you cry at Grandma or I'll have to spank you!" Even in jest, I was annoyed that she'd say that. My children always preferred to be held by me. While I understand that my IL's thought they were being helpful by taking my babies from me at family gatherings (to give me a break, I suspect) it was actually more stressful for me to have to hear my child crying while being passed around. My kids simply didn't like that. They got annoyed with me for holding my babies all the time. But I worked full time and the weekends, whenever there was a get together, was also MY time with my kids. They eventually learned. I explained a few times that they needed time to warm up. I understand IL problems all too well, unfortunately.

Just repeat that they need time to warm up. Beforst MIL reaches for them or gets mad that they're not running to her, I'd suggest playing a game with them, getting down on their level, and making the children more comfortable. Maybe you could engage her in a craft with your daughter? Ask her to read a book to your DD- I always find my kids will climb into the lap of the reader because they love to hear stories. That has always made a difference- my mom would always do that with my kids and they are still closer to her now. MIL likes to see them, but, like your IL's, doesn't spend much actual time playing with the kids when they're together.

[Chefzhat]

Knowing how your kids react, why not just have them in your arms when you open the door to your in-laws? They can be greeted in the safety of your arms, and then you can decide when to put them down. That seems the best way to handle a guest that doesn't seem to get the "hints" that their affections are too much, too soon for the little ones.

Seeing them once or twice a month hardly makes them strangers. How often do YOUR parents see them??

Boy, all that I hear about mother in laws around here (and other boards) leaves me not looking forward to my own boys getting married. :) Nothing personal to you . . . just making an observation.

Debie

[jmarie]

It would hurt my feelings to know that I had caused a child to have a melt-down. I do not think you are being unreasonable in expecting everyone to give your DD and DS some warm-up time...they are babies for crying out loud.

Would it help if you carried your DD in and let your DH carry DS in and just leave everything in the car until you have the situation under control? Or if they are visiting you, held the children until the child got used to them being there. Maybe if you have a picture or grams and gramps, you could start the warm up procedure before they (or you arrive).

I think you are exactly right in your feelings about your children being forced into hugging/kissing situations, where they have clearly drawn their own boundaries and yet no one (even dad, god love him) is paying any heed. We live in a different world, now...

good luck!
J

[mgs]

I have an almost 2.5 year old son. He sees his grandparents - both sets - only a couple times a year. He recognizes them and all that... so I personally would guess it isn't stranger anxiety(for your older one), but more a personality trait. Not that it is a bad one! They are observers first and so is my son. He doesn't act this way with family -but he does put on a show if a stranger in a checkout line tries to interact with him! I feel like hiding when he scowls at someone who is smiling and trying to play with him! He wants to check them out first before they start checking him out. What I do - when I think of it - is explain to him " we are going to the grocery store. there will probably be people you don't know there and they may smile or talk to you. they are being friendly" yada yada. I don't tell him how to react but I do try to tell him to 'be friendly' back.

Maybe you can try taking control of the situation from the beginning. Not only saying we are going to visit Grandma but we are going to visit them and they will probably want to give you a BIG hug as soon as they see you. Reiterate this every day, on the drive, and as you are walking through the door.

Another thing you can do is announce as you walk through the door "DD loves to play peek-a-boo these days! Peek-a-boo Grandma!" The one that always gets my son going in stressful situations is "where is baby?" He loves to shout "there he is!" even if he isn't hiding.. So keep her in your arms - carry her from the car through the door and hold onto her and start playing games right away.

A little later after you had a drink to calm your nerves you might be able to mention that DD gets overwhelmed by all the attention and needs a little warm up time. In a way you think your IL's will take it without getting offended.

Oh one last thought. DS will usually ask for his sippy cup when he is at a loss and seems to use it as a barrier - sips while he checks things out. Maybe you have something similar.

good luck. I have an out-law visit coming up on Thursday for the weekend and am totally stressed about it as well.

Meg

[mgs]

Boy, all that I hear about mother in laws around here (and other boards) leaves me not looking forward to my own boys getting married. :) Nothing personal to you . . . just making an observation.

Debie

I got along great with my in-laws until children were in the mix. Then it all changed for the worse. :p

How is your relationship with your IL's? Before and after kids?

Debie, in the words of Sara Moulton "you'll do better" :D

Meg

[BucknellAlum]

First, I agree that once a month visits are pretty often (that is a whole other thread I should start, about how "often" often is, because my DM and I do not agree!)

But anyway, my children have always been very shy with anyone who is not their parents. At those young ages, they definitely did not run to the grandparents or want to be picked up right away either.

You and DH do have to be on the same page on this. I would hope it would not get too blown out of proportion; I don't see why it would be a big deal if when they walk in the door, you are holding DD and gently say to the ILs, "oh, she's still in that tentative stage" and let them squeeze her hand to say hello, or something. And if they do acclimate in 10 minutes or so, and DD does sit down to read or something, then you can say "see, she just needed a few minutes to warm up".

If you and DH are having trouble agreeing on this strategy, there is probably an undercurrent of other emotions or past incidents affecting everyone's perception of this.

But I do wish you good luck, as I know my ILs didn't always appreciate having to "wait their turn" and I always wondered if they secretly thought I was doing something wrong in raising the kids, since they were so reticent.

[Chefzhat]

I got along great with my in-laws until children were in the mix. Then it all changed for the worse. :p

How is your relationship with your IL's? Before and after kids?

Debie, in the words of Sara Moulton "you'll do better" :D

Meg

Sadly, DH's dear mother passed away when I was expecting our youngest. I adored her while she was alive, I just didn't have her for very long.

I'll just remember how she was and emulate her!

Debie

[RebeccaT]

Gouri, I am sorry this has got you stressed out!

Julia can be shy with strangers as well, but she loves my ILs. I think that the reason she loves them and gets excited about seeing them is that they have done a LOT to get down on her level with her, playing with her and creating fun, so there is anticipation that they will do it again whenever she sees them. I think that the more your DH's family play and interact with DD and DS, beyond just wanting to hug and squeeze them, the less time it will take your kids to warm up on subsequent visits. Even Julia, who adores her grandparents, will occasionally hide behind my legs when they come over, but that initial shyness disolves within minutes once FIL starts playing chase or MIL starts singing a song. I have LOADS of IL issues (and remember, I had to LIVE with them for 5 months this summer!) but they are so great with my kids that it makes up for a lot.

I do think you need to talk to DH about this and present a united front, but instead of confronting him in a "why do your parents always do this" sort of way (which, as you have already anticipated, would quickly degenerate into an argument), what if you tried it like this: "DH, we really need to figure out a way to get DD and DS excited about visits with your family, so that we don't spend the entire visit dealing with meltdowns! How do you think we can do this?"

I do think that you would do a disservice to your argument if you call his family "strangers," and you might have a hard time getting DH to hear your concerns if he gets hung up on that term. They are his family, and you see them frequently by most people's standards. It sounds like your children's anxiety has less to do with them not being familiar with these people (you've done a lot already to make sure they know and recognize them) and more to do with them just having trouble switching gears when the scene changes.

[avariell]

i don't know that i have very much good advice, but i think you should realize that once to twice a month is actually a lot of visiting. i would love to see my nieces twice a month (fortunately because my sister moved to ohio, it is happening more often). i think you should recognize that they are putting effort into seeing your babies. i am not trying to attack you, i just wonder if you are taking the effort they are putting forth for granted?

anyway, what about letting your children talk on the phone with your IL's? ask your husband to encourage the interaction. i "talk" with my nieces all the time (2.5 yr and 13 mo.). it can be a challenge for me to think of things to talk about, but i know that they are thrilled to see aunt josie (at big family gatherings where there are lots of loud adults seeking kid attention). they definitely remember me.

it is obvious you adore your children and that you are trying to do your best for them. i always think that talking to your husband about your concerns is a good idea; however, if you need to vent about IL's maybe you should go to a friend or sibling?

i really don't mean to sound obnoxious in this post - i just think that IL situations are very tricky, and you must tread lightly (plus i love playing devil's advocate :)).

[Jessica]

I was horribly shy as a child and hated being forced to hug and kiss relatives. I think it shows disrespect for the child as an individual. I never force kisses and hugs on my nephews; I ask if they want a hug or kiss. We haven't had this issue with DS but I definitely would not want relatives grabbing him and making him uncomfortable, not for safety reasons but because it is disrespectful. Adults don't do that to each other.

[gertdog]

I was horribly shy as a child and hated being forced to hug and kiss relatives. I think it shows disrespect for the child as an individual. I never force kisses and hugs on my nephews; I ask if they want a hug or kiss. We haven't had this issue with DS but I definitely would not want relatives grabbing him and making him uncomfortable, not for safety reasons but because it is disrespectful. Adults don't do that to each other.

"Disrespectful" was the exact word I was going to use. Gouri, I'm sure your ILs love your kids and do not mean to distress them by showing their affection, but I do think it's important that children's personal space be as respected as an adult's would. On the other hand, it's important to model behavior for DS and DD to help them interact with their relatives. I'd second Debie's suggestion about having DS and DD in your arms as you arrive, and say simply but firmly "Oh, they've been so excited about seeing you, but now that we're here they need a few minutes." (I don't like saying a child is "shy" in front of the child). But then USE those few minutes to help your kids transition. In front of DS/DD and your relatives, point out MIL and say "There's grandma- she's so happy to see you! She'd like to give you a kiss." "There's Aunt Michelle- remember how you played Legos with her last time we were here?" "Daddy's so glad to see Grandma- he's going to give her a big hug!" This helps the relatives feel acknowledged and know that you're trying to help with the situation, gives them a chance to smile and wave and talk to the kids, and gives the kids some cues as well.

One of my ILs always swings my DS up in the air as soon as he walks in, and DS wigs out. I think it's the surprise and the lack of control that freaks him out, rather than being unfamiliar with my IL. So now I make sure that I'm holding DS when the IL arrives. The IL takes off his coat and sits down, and the grabbing/swinging opportunity passes; DS wiggles to get down after a few minutes and is happy to talk/play with IL.

[mrswaz]

Stand your ground Mom! Don't wait for your DH to say something, be firm about your children being your children. When my DD was having her first birthday, my MIL (whom I adore, btw) flew in to spend a few days with us. She'd spent time with DD only once or twice before. She started off keeping her distance, but it wasn't long before she would just pick her up with no warning and walk off with a screaming child, trying to get in a few hugs or whatnot. My DD had serious stranger anxiety, and after the second time DMIL "forced" a situation, I stepped in and took her back. DMIL made a comment about just wanting to spend time with DD and I said, "that's perfectly fine, but my daughter does not cry for no reason. If she cries, it means she wants Mommy and she gets Mommy." I was firm. Dead firm. And when I told DH about it later on he was a bit surpised I spoke to his Mom in that way, but no one- and I mean no one, comes between me and my children.

It sounds like you're looking for advice on how to talk to DH, I say just put it simply, but forcefully. I did. My children are my life, and if they are uncomfortable in any way, whatever is making the uncomfortable needs to stop. Instantly. I have zero qualms about walking up to my ILS and taking my child from them, my DH knows this now. And he had a choice to either back me up or just watch and get "a talk" from his parents later on. He chose to back me up.

I think the suggestion of both of you holding the children when someone walks in is a great way to try and avoid the rush at the beginning of a visit if that's at all possible. That's what I do with DS. He still gets a sort-of hug and a kiss on the cheek, but it's in the safety of Mom's arms, so it's tolerable for him.

[ggs830]

Okay, a lot of people to respond to. ;)


The OP sounds like she knows her children, knows their feelings and is very in tune with what they need from her and from new situations in order to feel comfortable and secure. I think she should be proud of that and proud for standing up for her children's feelings instead of pacifying adults who should know better than to put their need for instant gratification ahead of a scared child.

Thank you for saying this. I was actually surprised by a couple of responses to this thread, which seemed to suggest (maybe unintentionally) that either there was something wrong with my children, or that it was my fault that the kids were acting this way. I kind of thought it was a given that children this age (2 and 8 months) would be somewhat reticent in new situations with people they aren't that familar with.

As someone who was an EXTREMELY shy child around adults, I would have dreaded visits with anyone who would pick me up and try to kiss me no matter who they were.

**snip**

You need to speak up for your children even if it is their grandparents. Your daughter is telling you, but you have to act. I hope you can resolve it with no hurt feelings.

This was me too. When I was a child, my entire extended family lived in another country, and we only visited every 2-3 years. I always dreaded the inevitable push from my mom to hug and kiss my grandparents, aunts, uncles, etc. who I hadn't seen in years. If I hesitated, or protested, I would get in trouble. This is one of the reasons why I feel so strongly that DH and I need to stick up for our children.

Knowing how your kids react, why not just have them in your arms when you open the door to your in-laws? They can be greeted in the safety of your arms, and then you can decide when to put them down. That seems the best way to handle a guest that doesn't seem to get the "hints" that their affections are too much, too soon for the little ones.

Seeing them once or twice a month hardly makes them strangers. How often do YOUR parents see them??

Debie

I like, in theory, the idea of having the kids in arms when we arrive, but in practice, it doesn't work out well. MIL has, several times, forcefully taken DD from me or DH. Unless I want to get into a tug of war with her (happened once when DD was a newborn), I usually let her take DD, and then intervene as soon as DD starts resisting her. This is why I am so upset with DH, because he doesn't intervene.

So far, she hasn't done this with DS, who is always in arms. I suspect its because DD is currently more entertaining, but I'm sure we'll be having the same problem once DS starts walking and talking.

As for my parents, the kids see them all the time. I'm a SAHM and both my parents are retired, so we go over there, or they come over here, at least 2-3 times a week. I guess that's why I initially called the ILs strangers---my frame of reference was off, b/c they see my parents so often.


But I do wish you good luck, as I know my ILs didn't always appreciate having to "wait their turn" and I always wondered if they secretly thought I was doing something wrong in raising the kids, since they were so reticent.

I feel the same way. The last time we saw MIL before this past weekend, she made a comment about DD being shy because I'm a SAHM. :confused: I really don't get this because a) she's not shy, if you give her a few minutes to warm up, and b) what does the one have to do with the other?


Gouri, I am sorry this has got you stressed out!

Julia can be shy with strangers as well, but she loves my ILs. I think that the reason she loves them and gets excited about seeing them is that they have done a LOT to get down on her level with her, playing with her and creating fun, so there is anticipation that they will do it again whenever she sees them. I think that the more your DH's family play and interact with DD and DS, beyond just wanting to hug and squeeze them, the less time it will take your kids to warm up on subsequent visits.



See, this is what I would love to happen, but it sadly does not. Very rarely do my ILs make an effort to relate to DD on her level-- it is all about what they want, which is hugs and kisses and getting DD to "perform" (e.g. can you count for me? can you sign the ABC song, etc.). DD is up for hugging, kissing and performing, but not right away, and certainly not if you keep demanding it of her.

And I should make clear that the other side of DH's family (paternal side) do exactly as you described, Rebecca. DD only sees that side of the family about 2-3 times a year, but within minutes of our arrival on Thanksgiving, DD was playing with DH's aunt and cousin as if she had known them forever. It was all in how they approached her and interacted with her. Made all the difference.

i think you should recognize that they are putting effort into seeing your babies. i am not trying to attack you, i just wonder if you are taking the effort they are putting forth for granted?

anyway, what about letting your children talk on the phone with your IL's?



Actually, they don't really put forth much effort to see us-- we do 95% of the visiting. But, that's a whole 'nother thread. ;)

Talking on the phone is a good idea (although DS is only 8 months old, so I don't think that will work so well!). We'll have to try that one.

I was horribly shy as a child and hated being forced to hug and kiss relatives. I think it shows disrespect for the child as an individual. I never force kisses and hugs on my nephews; I ask if they want a hug or kiss. We haven't had this issue with DS but I definitely would not want relatives grabbing him and making him uncomfortable, not for safety reasons but because it is disrespectful. Adults don't do that to each other.


"Disrespectful" was the exact word I was going to use. Gouri, I'm sure your ILs love your kids and do not mean to distress them by showing their affection, but I do think it's important that children's personal space be as respected as an adult's would.



ITA with you two. This is why I think this issue is so important to me.



It sounds like you're looking for advice on how to talk to DH, I say just put it simply, but forcefully. I did. My children are my life, and if they are uncomfortable in any way, whatever is making the uncomfortable needs to stop. Instantly. I have zero qualms about walking up to my ILS and taking my child from them, my DH knows this now. And he had a choice to either back me up or just watch and get "a talk" from his parents later on. He chose to back me up.


Yeah, I'm more concerned about getting DH to follow through on standing up for the kids than getting my ILs to change their behavior. I really don't want to "get tough" with DH, but I've tried a soft approach in the past, and it hasn't worked. He's totally on board with me as far as agreeing that the children's needs have to be respected, but when it comes to standing up to his mom, he crumbles.

I'm going to talk to him tonight. Hopefully, we won't end up fighting. :o

[avariell]

aw i am sorry they don't put more effort into seeing them... that is too bad since they must be somewhat close in order to visit every month.

i started talking to my niece at 10-11 months. sometimes i just sing in the phone or babble about random things. but my sister says she always reacts (usually by trying to eat the phone :))

anyway - good luck talking to your husband.

[Robyn1007]

I was actually surprised by a couple of responses to this thread, which seemed to suggest (maybe unintentionally) that either there was something wrong with my children, or that it was my fault that the kids were acting this way. I kind of thought it was a given that children this age (2 and 8 months) would be somewhat reticent in new situations with people they aren't that familar with.

I'm assuming that you're directing this at least partly at me. I didn't mean to suggest that there is something wrong with your children, children all have their own personalities and limits but was merely trying to suggest things that may help them to deal with the situation (which still doesn't sound like a new or unfamiliar situation to me).

As much as you may want your ILs to change they may never so developing a way to help your children and make sure you're not doing anything to influence their reactions could be essential. I'm the same way with people that I'm not all that chummy with. For example, a family member took some attitude with me prior to Thanksgiving about a dish I was planning to bring so when I saw her come in with that dish plus stovetop stuffing I didn't have the best of attitudes. I'm sure kids would have picked up on that.

[Chefzhat]

Unless I want to get into a tug of war with her (happened once when DD was a newborn)

Good lord. I am constantly astounded by the way people behave. :eek: She actually YANKED your child from you??? That would only happen once, let me tell you. :mad:

Sorry you're dealing with all this. Sounds like she's too old to teach her the social graces, huh?

[ggs830]

Good lord. I am constantly astounded by the way people behave. :eek: She actually YANKED your child from you??? That would only happen once, let me tell you. :mad:

Sorry you're dealing with all this. Sounds like she's too old to teach her the social graces, huh?

Oh yeah, used to happen all the time when DD was a baby. We'd come in, DD would be in my arms (usually), and MIL would grab her from my arms w/o saying a word to me and take off into another room. Not even a "hi" before the snatch and grab. I said something the first few times it happened, and nothing changed, so from that point on, I let her do it, and the minute DD would start to cry, I'd take her away. One time, when DD started crying, MIL actually yelled at her. I ripped into her good that time, but really, it didn't make her change her behavior (other than to not yell at DD again.)

Well, my talk with DH will have to wait until tomorrow. Some crisis at work has him hunched over his laptop right now, and I'm too tired to wait for him to get done. Oh well.

[gertdog]

Good lord. I am constantly astounded by the way people behave. :eek: She actually YANKED your child from you??? That would only happen once, let me tell you. :mad:


You mean you didn't have to make a mental note? :p Note to self: When I am an MIL/grandma, do not forcibly tear infant from mom's arms.

Like you, I'm amazed by how some people behave.

Gouri, what's up with MIL taking DD off to other rooms? Is she trying to get some quiet time with her amidst the chaos? Does she think she's helping by taking DD to a quieter room? Is she unable to stand for long periods of time? Does she have a chair she prefers to sit in, so she takes DD with her there? Trying to figure out why she does this. Taking DD from you upsets DD, and taking her somewhere that she can't see you probably upsets her more...

[Robyn1007]

Good lord. I am constantly astounded by the way people behave. :eek: She actually YANKED your child from you??? That would only happen once, let me tell you. :mad:

Sorry you're dealing with all this. Sounds like she's too old to teach her the social graces, huh?

Sorry, I missed that statement, I agree that tearing a child from your arms and playing tug of war is uncalled for and would piss me off.

[ggs830]

You mean you didn't have to make a mental note? :p Note to self: When I am an MIL/grandma, do not forcibly tear infant from mom's arms.

Like you, I'm amazed by how some people behave.

Gouri, what's up with MIL taking DD off to other rooms? Is she trying to get some quiet time with her amidst the chaos? Does she think she's helping by taking DD to a quieter room? Is she unable to stand for long periods of time? Does she have a chair she prefers to sit in, so she takes DD with her there? Trying to figure out why she does this.

I think MIL thinks that if DD can't see me or DH, she won't fuss and cry for us, and that she will then be amenable for hugs and kisses. :confused: It makes no sense to me, because taking DD away from DH and I just makes her that much more confused, scared, anxious, upset, etc. That's what happened yesterday, and what caused the meltdown.

Really, the more I think about it, I simply do not understand why she persists in this. Why would you do something, knowing it's going to make your granddaughter cry? I don't get it, I really don't. And now I'm angry again. Sigh.

[mst]

I did not read everything in detail, but wanted to comment. My DD is also super shy when she first sees most people. I also do not want to push the affection thing on her, but I do see myself saying "do you want to give so-and-so a hug?", and then I get annoyed at myself. So, even if your husband is 100% on your side, sometimes, it is just such a part of our own childhood that it is a hard habit to break.

Second of all, I resent as an adult that I always have to kiss my IL's. It is so fake to me. We don't really like each other, but we hug and kiss like we missed each other? Stupid. My SMIL is always stroking my face- which truly makes me bananas. I think I am gearing up to say something to her about that. I loathe people touching my face. Even my husband doesn't.

I constantly get comments about Ilyssa being shy because I am a SAHM. Um, no. She is who she is. She is painfully shy around other people. So is my husband. I make a huge effort to do activities in groups every single day, and playdates, but she is just a shy person.

I would have your husband talk to your parents about a warm-up period. Also, we try to do the ol' High Five when Ilyssa does not want to touch someone who wants to hug/kiss her.

FWIW, my IL's see DD about once every three months. We live an hour from them. They fly (with FIL paying, of course) to see SMIL's grandchildren about every six weeks. She was just complaining to me about how much she misses them, but when we invited them to come and visit us, they did not want to drive to us because they are so busy being retired. Sorry- this is your IL vent thread!:p

[mgs]

the idea of being shy b/c you are a sahm goes against every seperation anxiety theory out there so I just don't buy it. I am a SAHM and some kids are shy and some are not. It is a persnoality trait, and it is a shame that your MIL thinks it is something you have "done" to her. My mom stayed at home with us 3 kids and my sister was terribly shy, my brother was labled 'quiet' and I am as outgoing as the best of them! so --- you never know.

Poor girl. Her boundries need to be respected.

Can you follow your MIL into the other room? Seperating her from you is NOT the answer obviously.

I am good at elaborate schemes - wonder if you could come up one - carry her through the door and when MIL goes for her turn your shoulder to her and say "Oh DD look at the Christmas tree!" and walk over to it or something like that.

((hugs)) i truly know how stressful In-law visits can be. I think they forget the little details of how hard it is to raise kids. Or they just didn't care about the kids feelings when they were raising kids. (that is what I think is the deal with my inlaws) No one was ever allowed to feel anything but happy. If you were in a bad mood go to your room until you can be happy. :rolleyes:

the other thing is that the word 'shy' has such a bad connotation. Why don't you tell your MIL that she is cautious and you like her to be that way. You think it is a strong characteristic -which it is! and you encourage it.:D

[Mpenny1001]

I'm going to throw this out there as some information you can use when you talk to DH. Most child abuse is done by someone the child knows. Now, I'm absolutely NOT saying that I think your ILs are going to abuse your children - I'm not saying that at all!!! But, it is soooo important that we don't teach our children that they need to do what an adult says or give affection to someone simply because it is Aunt Janie or Grandmpa Ed or Neighbor Joe or Teacher Cindy or someone else the child "knows" and sees relatively often. Children need to be allowed to set their own physical boundaries. Most kids are born with good instincts but, in an effort to be polite and social, we train our kids not to listen to those instincts. It sounds like your DD has good instincts - hold back a few minutes, get accustomed to the situation, and then proceed once comfortable. My DD (who is just over 3) is the same way, and frankly, I hope it continues on at least through her young adult years!