Duggars have their 19th baby

[KristiB]

She's tiny!

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20326622,00.html

She arrived earlier than expected, but the 19th Duggar baby is here!

Michelle and Jim Bob Duggar welcomed daughter Josie Brooklyn, weighing 1 lb., 6 oz., at 6:27 p.m. Thursday, at the University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences, Arkansas.

Michelle, who has been in the hospital recovering from a gallstone, was taken to the OR for an emergency C-section. She is resting comfortably and the baby is stable and in the NICU for extended care, a rep for the network tells PEOPLE exclusively.

"The most important thing right now is for mom and baby Josie to get as much rest as possible," reads the statement to PEOPLE. "The family is grateful for all the prayers and well wishes during their recovery."

[Shugness]

Wow - yes, she is tiny! One of my nieces was a little over 2 pounds when she was born and it wasn't nearly as "ok" as they make it sound in that article - it was a several weeks before we knew she was out of the woods. I'm glad the duggars baby is doing ok as of right now and pray she will continue to improve....but I hope they will now accept that they've been taking a huge risk by still having children at her age and consider their family complete.

[HejazSunKat]

Well, congratulations, I guess. :rolleyes: Has anybody ever seen Say Yes To The Dress on TLC? My new favorite show thanks to a Thanksgiving weekend marathon, it follows brides shopping for gowns at Kleinfeld in NYC. Anyway, the Duggars decided to get a gown for Michelle to wear to renew their vows for their 25th wedding anniversay and they brought ALL the kids plus their son's pregnant wife to the appointment. I've never seen their show but it was interesting to see how Michelle looked at Jim-Bob whenever she tried on a dress looking anxiously for his permission or approval on what she was wearing. Wonder if their marriage always works that way or if the pregnancies and being mother to that many kids has sapped all her own will and personality.

[TKay]

I just read this today. I did a double-take. Number 19?! Didn't they just have number 18? I'd agree that it's probably time to consider the family complete. Of course, I couldn't imagine 6 or 8 or 10. So what do I know? I guess I just feel like it begins to get irresponsible at a certain point.

[hlao23]

I just read this today. I did a double-take. Number 19?! Didn't they just have number 18?

If you have a certain number of kids everyone is probably saying that after every baby. You have to or you couldn't possibly even HAVE that many! ;)

"Number 9?! Didn't the just have number 8?"

"Number 13?! Didn't they just have number 12?"

etc.
etc. ;) :D

[ellery]

....but I hope they will now accept that they've been taking a huge risk by still having children at her age and consider their family complete.


The news is reporting that she delivered early because she developed severe pre-eclampsia (or from complications related to her gallbladder). As far as I am aware (having delivered my son early because of the same thing), pre-eclampsia is caused by medical issues, not age. And pregnancy is known to aggravate gallbladder issues, again, not age. Tread lightly with the age comments please. :)

[PurplePotato]

So everytime I read "Too Many Daves" to DS I think of the Duggars. I wonder if/when they'll reach 23? Did they read it once and decide it was a challenge?:p

[ClaraB]

The news is reporting that she delivered early because she developed severe pre-eclampsia (or from complications related to her gallbladder). As far as I am aware (having delivered my son early because of the same thing), pre-eclampsia is caused by medical issues, not age. And pregnancy is known to aggravate gallbladder issues, again, not age. Tread lightly with the age comments please. :)
Actually, preeclampsia is associated with age - it's more common in women under 20 or over 40.

I'm guessing Michelle's gallbladder symptoms weren't really her gallbladder at all. Hopefully she and her baby will do fine.

[ellery]

Actually, preeclampsia is associated with age - it's more common in women under 20 or over 40.


I thought I'd heard almost everything there was on the subject but have never heard this. Having had it once and being pregnant again, my pregnancy specialist (Reproductive Endocrinologist) has educated me quite a bit on the subject but this has never been mentioned. My understanding is that it has something to do with blood flow maybe, but they're not really sure what causes it exactly or how to prevent it. It's not anything I would wish on anyone and I hate the "blame the victim" mentality with the seemingly implied message of "that's what you get for having kids when you're so old." Much as I wouldn't emulate the Duggars and can't imagine why they would keep having kids, it's a free country. Lots of people who probably shouldn't have kids do. And if she wants to have another child at the oh so advanced age of 44, well, that's her prerogative.

[ClaraB]

I thought I'd heard almost everything there was on the subject but have never heard this. Having had it once and being pregnant again, my pregnancy specialist (Reproductive Endocrinologist) has educated me quite a bit on the subject but this has never been mentioned. My understanding is that it has something to do with blood flow maybe, but they're not really sure what causes it exactly or how to prevent it. It's not anything I would wish on anyone and I hate the "blame the victim" mentality with the seemingly implied message of "that's what you get for having kids when you're so old." Much as I wouldn't emulate the Duggars and can't imagine why they would keep having kids, it's a free country. Lots of people who probably shouldn't have kids do. And if she wants to have another child at the oh so advanced age of 44, well, that's her prerogative.
I don't disagree with you. I'm also in my 40's, and if I decided to have another child, I would be very upset if people told me I shouldn't. However, it would me foolish of me to ignore the increased risks to both myself and my baby. It's not discrimination, it's just a medical reality.

[VALERIEA234]

Maybe i am to stupid, but why would anyone want 19 children. For goodness sake she is not a donut machine. Where is all the money coming from to support all of them? Another thing do the kids get any sort of special attention, which i think is needed.how can you take proper care of the chrilden, if you are constantly pg!!!!
Val

[jellyben]

Maybe i am to stupid, but why would anyone want 19 children.
Val

I guess the same reason someone wants 1 kid, or 4 kids, or no kids. Different strokes and all that.

[mbrogier]

The Duggars have no debt, not even a mortgage and were doing quite well on Jim-Bob's salary-- some sort of family business and also public office-- even before the added money from their show on TLC.

While I don't understand having 19 children--included in this are 4 previous C sections, I do understand their viewpoint of it being in God's hands. They believe that all children are a gift from God and that the more they have, the more God has blessed them. I grew up in churches similar to the one that they go to. I believe that God controls everything that happens in my life, and that everything works together for good.

I personally wouldn't make the medical risks that they have made. I got a hysterectomy because my medical conditions made pregnancy too dangerous. I just couldn't put Rob through all of that. Maybe my faith isn't as strong.

I do think that Michele and Jim-Bob have been very fortunate that they haven't experienced more complications. I don't think that *age* should be brought up as a reason for not having more children. Scar tissue from multiple C sections and the risk of uterine abruption, yes. It does seem like they get good prenatal care since they were at U of Arkansas medical center.

I have also noticed Michele's tendency to look at Jim-Bob like she's waiting for approval. I've seen that a lot in fundamentalist groups. I do think that they get along very well. They are quite fascinating to watch because of their interactions.

I take issue with them only because they teach that the girls' main occupation in life is to get married and have more babies, so education is unnecessary. As a barren woman in fundamentalist groups similar to this, I have been told that I'm barren because of sin in my life. :rolleyes::mad:

No, God has chosen a different path for me. My higher education has helped me enjoy my life. I love art, history, and literature. I can entertain myself by reading and watching documentaries. I would have missed out on so much in our world if I had only gone to school long enough to get my MRS. degree.

Rob and I have decided to step back from church membership at this time because this mindset of you're not anybody unless you're a mother is so hurtful.

Ellery, I hope and pray that your pregnancy is a safe and healthy one.

[donleyk]

Rob and I have decided to step back from church membership
.

I should hope so. That's ridiculous. I'd find somewhere else to spend my time. What tiny, tiny minds. And more frightening, they are reproducing.

<shaking my head> This truly boggles my mind. Hugs to you!

[BucknellAlum]

While I don't understand having 19 children--included in this are 4 previous C sections, I do understand their viewpoint of it being in God's hands. They believe that all children are a gift from God and that the more they have, the more God has blessed them. I grew up in churches similar to the one that they go to. I believe that God controls everything that happens in my life, and that everything works together for good.


I can't tell you how angry this belief makes me (this is not directed at you mbrogier at all!!! I have heard variations on this idea from many fundamentalist and other churchgoers). !!! :(

People who preach this idea have NO IDEA how hurtful it is to people who are infertile or otherwise struggle with having children. The argument that birth control is wrong, because "God decided how many children to give you" is flat-out offensive on many levels. Fine, if you don't want to use birth control, but do not use that stance to then say God will decide how many kids to give you.

What does that say to the infertile couple? Or the woman who miscarries multiple times? Or the couple who have a still-born baby? That God decided they shouldn't be parents?? Oh, God thought it was just hunky-dory to give the unwed teenage high-school drop out mother 3 kids by age 19, but decided against giving a baby to a stable married couple? Ridiculous.

. . . sorry to get on my soapbox, that is a touchy subject for me . . .

[mbrogier]

A good arguing point to people that think that way is the story of Hannah in the Old Testament. God closed her womb, and she went through a lot because of what people decided must be wrong with her since she couldn't bear children. The story points out that there wasn't anything spiritually wrong with Hannah, but that God had chosen her to be the mother of the high priest Samuel, who was the priest that anointed Saul and then David kings of a new country, Israel.

It amazes me how easily people forget stories like Hannah and also Elisabeth, the mother of John the Baptist.

I've also heard the analogy of how having children is like preparing a trip to Italy--dreaming of Italy, hearing all the stories of people that already went, and then climbing on the plane and finding out that you're not going to Italy but are headed towards Holland. Holland is a wonderful country and has great places to see, but it takes a while to get over the *idea* of not getting to Italy.

There's no way that I could take care of a baby/toddler in my health. Perhaps one day we can adopt, but I relish being the aunt that every kid wishes they have. I love spending time with my nieces and nephews and spoiling them rotten. Rob and I enjoy being a family of 2.

[FLFlygirl]

Bucknell,

I could not agree with you more. I usually stay out of the kid threads because I do not have children, but you hit the nail right on the head.

One of two mottos I live by: Beware of zealots of any stripe.

It's usually the zealots that want to dictate how the rest of us should live. :confused:

And mbrogier, all the best to you in your health struggles. If I were in your shoes, I suspect I would have made a similar choice. You don't have to justify or explain anything to anyone. I'm sorry there are those with such hurtful attitudes.

My DH and I did not have children for our own reasons and I don't owe or offer any explainations to anyone other than my closest friends. People would ask all the time, so I finally started saying something to effect of: "I can't even keep my plants alive, so nothing higher than single-cell organisms in my house. If it wants to live in my house, it better know how to feed and clothe itself. That includes my DH. And his clothing choices are suspect at best..." And that usually ended the conversation on a joking, kidding around note with no openings for further discussion.

[JenniferJJ]

Rob and I have decided to step back from church membership at this time because this mindset of you're not anybody unless you're a mother is so hurtful.



Micah,

THANK YOU. It was so nice to finally find someone else who felt this way. For a long time, I had to make that decision, too. I could NOT believe the comments I heard. Unfortunately, I have seen that attitude elsewhere, but mostly at church. No, God values everyone. I don't know if has planned for me to have no children and not get married or if it's just a fallen world, and so things will not be as I would like on this earth. Heck, I'm be happy to be a family of 2.

I've read that number of people following Jesus outside the official church is rapidly growing. I would bet a large number of those people are singles and couples without children.

I like the Italy/Holland story. I am really enjoying my life in Holland (and now more than ever), but I really thought I would be going to Italy.

The good news is that I have finally found a church with a very informal structure and a different emphasis on what we do. Some people attend on Sunday mornings, some people only attend the house groups. But one of our main focuses is the service we do in the community and that seems to help to not separate people by their place in life.

[Sara_R]

I was just talking about them with a friend. If they went the route of Seven Brides for Seven Brothers they would almost be through the alphabet. :D

[Kay Henderson]

The fact that the Duggars are paying the complete current financial cost of their large family is a good thing, but doesn't address the larger cost to society and the planet. I can't help but ask, what if everyone made the decision to have a large number of children? As wealthy North Americans, we use many times the resources as do people in developing nations.

Kay

[jellyben]

The fact that the Duggars are paying the complete current financial cost of their large family is a good thing, but doesn't address the larger cost to society and the planet. I can't help but ask, what if everyone made the decision to have a large number of children? As wealthy North Americans, we use many times the resources as do people in developing nations.

Kay

What if everyone decided to have no children? Obviously there would be serious ramifications. I think people that have such large families are few and far between and I don't think we really need to worry about a 19-kid family epidemic.;)