Women in the Workplace

[JenZen]

Do you ever feel discriminated against because you are a woman? Or, how about age? Sometimes, I really wonder. I work in a very male-dominated industry, and things always seem like a fight. Anyone else have this problem, and if so, what do you do?

[SueK]

Jen, in my previous job, I certainly felt that way. That company was a privately owned foreign company with manufacturing facilities in the U.S. We pretty much were expected to adapt to their culture, and as such, the majority of managers were men.

I work at a university now, and the atmosphere is much different, but perhaps that is due to the people I work for, and not the fact that it's academia, and not corporate. Regardless, it was a breath of fresh air to switch jobs! One thing I have noticed in this job, though, is that you are looked down upon sometimes if you don't have more than a B.S. or B.A----people can be degree snobs!

[Grace]

I am in sales, and have never felt discriminated against. But even before I was in sales, I never felt discriminated against, so perhaps it's a perception thing (maybe I'm just oblivious to put downs/insults?!)? I do know in sales, however, women tend to do better than men, and therefore I think women are taken very seriously in this field, at least. Just my .02.

[SueK]

Originally posted by Grace
I am in sales, and have never felt discriminated against. But even before I was in sales, I never felt discriminated against, so perhaps it's a perception thing (maybe I'm just oblivious to put downs/insults?!)?

Grace, I don't think it's a perception issue. Anyone who knows me will tell you that I'm a very assertive person. In my case, it was the issue of dealing with an international company, and their culture. If anything, my assertiveness was probably looked upon as too aggressive for a woman, but regardless, that is not why I left. I left because I didn't want to work full-time anymore.

[Grace]

Oh Gosh, Sue, I guess what I wrote came out wrong! What I meant is that I am famous for not being aware of things that are obvious to others!! I sometimes live in my own la-la land, and in my own little world, if I don't see it, it's not there!! :D That's all I meant, I never meant to imply that maybe you are overly sensitive or something.

I guess I was trying to say that perhaps I WAS discriminated against somewhere/sometime, but I was just too dopey or clueless to realize it, and that's why I never felt it, that's all!! I really didn't mean to offend.

[beejayw1]

I was discriminated against on the basis of gender. A man was hired in a position junior to me, was paid 20% more than me, and - despite my continuing excellent reviews and recommendations and performance - was promoted over me. This was announced at the company Christmas party.

I was told that I did not need a corporate American Express card for travel because (to quote the president of the company) "Why does she need it? She's a woman."

What did I do? I started looking into what was done and how, and noting whatever inequities I discovered. Armed with my information (took a while to assemble) I went to the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission and filed a complaint. Having obtained a waiver from them, I retained counsel and filed a lawsuit. It was fascinating, once we were able to subpoena information, to see just what my employer had been doing and how seriously I had been underpaid. The fellow who had been promoted over me (a nice guy, by the way) was shown not to have been as good a worker as me., too.) My erstwhile employer settled. Among other things, I got myself a beautiful tourmaline and sapphire ring.

That was a while ago (like 18 years). Thanks to other women like me who did not hesitate to yell when they encountered discrimination, it isn't as prevalent, but it's still there. (and unfortunately, there are folks who scream when it hasn't happened)

What to do now, if I were you?

Document what's going on so that you know whether you are actually dealing with discrimination. If you feel that you are, approach your superiors courteously and point out the inequities - but don't use the 'discrimation' term. If you don't get satisfaction, and you wish to pursue matters, go to the EEOC (this is something you MUST do if you plan to pursue this, or your case will be barred). You cannot file suit without going through the EEOC for ANY sort of discrimination action because discrimination is a Federal offense and must be handled through the channels set up by the government. Also, you must take action (i.e. file with the EEOC within 180 days of the most recent incident of discrimination action.

But I hope it won't get that far.

Incidentally, not only did I prosecute a discrimination action, but I also used to handle them in later years.

[sal]

I work in a male-dominated industry, and also feel frustrated - but I wonder if it is my perception and not reality. For ex. I can give a client an answer and they get upset, do not like what I tell them, do not believe what I say is correct, etc. but when my male boss gives them the same answer they are "nice as pie." At this point I just look at it like this: I must work and this is just a job, not my career of choice. As long as I am getting what I need, i.e. the salary, I shouldn't complain. These people may "judge" me based on what they think they know about me. I just try to remember this in my personal dealings with customer service, etc. sally

[Veronica]

I've never felt discriminated against working for U.S. companies, but when I recently started working for an international company that all changed. Our non-American management team has made it rather clear that it doesn't like female managers and has restructured the company so that only males (with a few American males sprinkled in) are at the top.

An example of what I consider unfair treatment - on Christmas Eve there were about 4 of us still in the office around 5:00 p.m. - me and 3 junior-level men. One of the honchos walked right up to me and said he needed me to stay late and address envelopes for him (some urgent checks had to go out and his admin had already left for the day). Did he even consider asking the 3 other men around me? Not even. I was pretty PO'ed. I did as asked (I'm being paid, after all!), but I've started to look for another job. I don't like the signs around here.

[JenZen]

Good morning, all.

By discrimination, I don't really mean anything direct. It's more of a glass-ceiling mentality. I believe I am good at what I do, and I've always received glowing reviews, but I have to work harder to prove myself. I don't want to give a ton of details, but you need a few to understand. I work in the hunting and fishing industry, which mainly targets men. There is a real "boy's club" mentality at work. If you aren't passionate about the sport, things are a little harder. I end up being the gears behind the clock face, per se. The guys get to do the hunting trips, the patting on the back, the glory parts of the job, and I am left here to do all the work. Things are definitely not on an even keel, but it's nothing I can document.

I know they respect my work, and think highly of me, but there is a difference between us. It just becomes very frustrating, because respect goes beyond what we do at work.

Just a little venting. Thanks for listening.

[SueK]

Grace- no offense taken. And I apologize for my response being a bit too snippy! I should know better than to post at the end of a long day! :)

Anyway, Veronica- I empathize with you, because as I mentioned in my other post, working with a different culture can be challenging!

[beejayw1]

Originally posted by JenZen
The guys get to do the hunting trips, the patting on the back, the glory parts of the job, and I am left here to do all the work. Things are definitely not on an even keel, but it's nothing I can document.

Yes it is. Believe it or not, 'hanging out together' like that is often used as evidence of 'discrimination'. (Classic example was when a new congresswoman started at Capitol Hill and heard that a group was going to caucus. She was all set to join in - until she found out that they were going to caucus in the men's room.)

But if you're happy there, or more or less content, that's fine.