It's pronounced NOO-KLEER!!!!!!!

[beckms]

Let me preface this by saying that I don't like watching Bush give speeches. I think it's painful, he seems so uncomfortable. Let me also say that I thought he was unusually well-spoken last night (no comment about the content of his speech, but at least he used big words in the right context).

That said...

Will SOMEBODY PLEASE inform our president that the word "nuclear" is NOT pronounced NUK-U-LER??????

He said it about 10 times last night...his poor advisors must have been squirming backstage ("Darnit, George, if we've told you once, we've told you a thousand times...")...:p

OK, rant over. It's one of my major pet peeves. That, and the misspelling/mispronunciation of "chipotle".

Back to cooking.


:cool:

[gertdog]

Our theory is that his advisors think it sounds like "everyday guy" language that will connect with the audience and so they don't correct it.

I got curious about alternate pronunciations and found this on the Merriam Webster site. Especially note the bit at the end about usage and pronunciation. Interesting!

Main Entry: nu·cle·ar
Pronunciation: 'nü-klE-&r, 'nyü-, ÷-ky&-l&r
Function: adjective
Date: 1846
1 : of, relating to, or constituting a nucleus
2 a : of or relating to the atomic nucleus <nuclear reaction> <nuclear physics> b : used in or produced by a nuclear reaction (as fission) <nuclear fuel> <nuclear waste> <nuclear energy> c (1) : being a weapon whose destructive power derives from an uncontrolled nuclear reaction (2) : of, produced by, or involving nuclear weapons <the nuclear age> <nuclear war> (3) : armed with nuclear weapons <nuclear powers> d : of, relating to, or powered by nuclear energy <a nuclear submarine> <the nuclear debate> <a nuclear plant>

usage Though disapproved of by many, pronunciations ending in \-ky&-l&r\ have been found in widespread use among educated speakers including scientists, lawyers, professors, congressmen, U.S. cabinet members, and at least one U.S. president and one vice president. While most common in the U.S., these pronunciations have also been heard from British and Canadian speakers.

[lorilei]

I just have to say... poor guy.

I'll admit it. The pronunciation bugs me. But that has GOT to be a regional (mis)pronunciation or something. He's not the only person I've heard pronounce it that way... in fact, in some places, I would venture a guess that it's the ONLY way the word is said.

RETURNING TO SAY:

Thanks, Stephanie... I knew there had to be a good explanation!!

[beckms]

oops, that was gertdog's explanation. I think we should just give up and change the spelling of the word.:rolleyes:

[KathrynY]

I am glad I'm not the only one who was bothered by this pronunciation!! :o I must not be an "everyday guy"...

[beckms]

Um...I don't think they need to make him any more "everyday" than he already is...

Just MHO.;)

In his defense, though, he's probably really fun at parties.:p

[stefania4]

My fiance insists that Bush pronounces it correctly. We finally had to ban this as a topic of discussion.

However, I heard him speak in person a few weeks ago when he visited Atlanta, and I didn't catch any glaring errors in grammar or pronunciation.

[lindrusso]

Originally posted by beckms
Will SOMEBODY PLEASE inform our president that the word "nuclear" is NOT pronounced NUK-U-LER??????

LOL, Diana. This has always bugged my DH - he comments on it all the time! :D

Now, chipotle I have sympathy for - it's not exactly obvious how to pronounce it and, until recently, wasn't a particularly common household word. :)

[lorilei]

Originally posted by lindrusso
Now, chipotle I have sympathy for - it's not exactly obvious how to pronounce it and, until recently, wasn't a particularly common household word. :)

UGH.

Don't get me started on CHIP POLT TEE.... ew.ew.ew.


And I really hope that NUCLEAR isn't a household word!!! :D

[beckms]

stafania4: tell your fiance to talk to me. :D I study chemistry. Bush most definitely pronounces it wrong, at least as far as the spelling is concerned.

Now, there are schools of thought that say that common mispronunciations can become acceptable if enough people use them. I think that's what's happened to nuclear. But let me tell you, people who know what the word means and who use it every day (like chemists, physisists, etc) squirm when they hear it pronounced wrong. I mean, just look at the spelling! It's perfectly clear! There is simply no vowel between the c and the l! People would balk if someone pronounced the word "clear" as "kyu-lear", wouldn't they? Same idea.

It seems obvious to me that we jsut can't go to war when we have such serious issues to deal with right at home, like the pronunciation of words. :p

Can you tell I'm procrastinating studying?? :D

[lorilei]

Originally posted by beckms
I mean, just look at the spelling! It's perfectly clear! There is simply no vowel between the c and the l!

Kinda like chipotle :)

Definitely doesn't look like chipolte to me ... but I digress. We all have our pet "words". I try to be tolerant... that's the best I can do.

And I think it's fascinating (linguistically) to see how words grow and change in language. Must be really frustrating to the technical people, but it's brain food for us English people :)

[SandyM]

Originally posted by beckms
OK, rant over. It's one of my major pet peeves. That, and the misspelling/mispronunciation of "chipotle".

I was stranded at home on Wednesday morning, waiting out traffic muddling its way through a blizzard. Normally I wouldn't be home to see it, but someone from CL was on the Today show. She made chili, and threw in minced chi-PAH-tlay peppers.

I'll admit, I've never heard anyone say chi-POHL-tay before, but this one had me scratching my head.

Perhaps it was her southern twang?

[lorilei]

:) Beck - you DO know I'm kidding (not harassing you evilly) about the chipotle thing, right?

And Sandy - People around here say CHI POLT EE all the time. Drives me wild.

[Molli526]

I haven't really notice about nuclear, but I think I say it wrong sometimes, so maybe that's why :o

On to the important stuff. I pronounce chipotle chi - poht - lay.

Is this the right way?

If not, what is???

[Grace]

I LOVE the pres - but I must admit his mispronounciation makes me (and my DH) crazy too! I keep thinking that if I ever have the opportunity to meet him, I will have to tell him! :D Can you imagine? "It's an honor to meet you sir, but hasn't anyone told you it's Noo-CLEE-ar?!!!!"

And I am constantly correcting the people in my office for their mispronounciation of chipotle - we have a Chipotle restaurant around here we go to a lot, so the word gets used a lot in the office, and almost everyone says it wrong. :rolleyes:

And then there's the ever popular "Realtor" - (it's Ree-AL-tor, not REEL-a-tor)..... :D

[claire797]

For the record, Clinton said nuclear wrong too.

[mrswaz]

I frequently get asked how to pronounce Chipotle. My answer- and it seems to help people remember- is "Remotely-Chipotle." The little rhyme helps them remember I think. (Not to mention it's kinda fun to say!)

Remember the different pronounciations for Harassment? Or the new pronounciation for terror? (Terra? What is that?) I too cringed everytime the Pres said Nu-kyu-ler. Here we go again...changing the English language.

[Molli526]

Originally posted by mrswaz
I frequently get asked how to pronounce Chipotle. My answer- and it seems to help people remember- is "Remotely-Chipotle." The little rhyme helps them remember I think. (Not to mention it's kinda fun to say!)



Hey thanks! Glad to know I am pronouncing both words correctly :)

[Bailey]

Originally posted by lorilei
:) People around here say CHI POLT EE all the time. Drives me wild.
I've heard EMERIL do this!:(

[Laurielee]

Thanks for informing me on Chipotle, I have always pronounced it Chipolte, I never noticed the spelling, studpid me!, So driving to work this morning they were advertising the new Subway Chipotle Sandwich. And I was thinking these hick radio announcers dont even know how to pronounce Chipolte, much less know what one is! They were saying (Chipotleh) and said Subway gave them the correct pronunciation, Of course I thought they were wrong. Okay from now on it is Chipolte, darn it is Chipotle. Boy, that is a tongue twister.

and as for Bush - I did not see him but DH also thought he had really toned done his rhetoric.
Laurie

[gertdog]

Originally posted by claire797
For the record, Clinton said nuclear wrong too.

I cringed when he said it too. :) I think he must be the president they're referring to in the dictionary entry.

[makarios]

The butchered pronunciation of "nuclear" makes me a bit nuts, too!

Originally posted by SandyM
I've never heard anyone say chi-POHL-tay before...
Bobby Flay pronounces it that way -- makes me cringe because, since he is an "authority" in the realm of food, people are going to learn to pronounce it the way he does.

Annoying, but I do realize there are more important things... :rolleyes:

[stefania4]

Originally posted by mrswaz
Remember the different pronounciations for Harassment? Or the new pronounciation for terror? (Terra? What is that?) Yes, Terra and erra (for "error") drive me crazy. Whenever they talk about a "terra" attack I start looking for my sister, Tara...

[SandyM]

Originally posted by stefania4
Whenever they talk about a "terra" attack I start looking for my sister, Tara...

Is she the violent type? ;) :D

[gianttrev]

Terra- Wasn't that Willow's girlfriend on Buffy? :)

What is a Terraist? Someone who visits earth?

I'm reminded by that Simpson's Episode when they visit the apple farm, and Homer turns to Lisa, "It's pronounced NOOK-YOU-LER honey, Nook-you-ler"
In that ep they also hit upon foy-ledge, and lie-berry.
Next up is Feb-you-ary :p

[AndreaU]

Didn't Papa Bush also have 'pronuncication' problems with 'nucular'? I guess the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. :rolleyes:

I did watch the whole speech last night and I don't usually watch GW speak, but is he always that way? He seemed to be just barely muddling through. Maybe he was just really tired- I'm sure he can't be well-rested lately. Though I will admit, he kept a decent sense of humor about the whole question & answer period.

[swquilts]

Emeril drives me batty when he says "paster" for pasta and "jalapeeeno" for jalapeno. It is a New England thing?

(Disclaimer: no New England bashing here.....;) )

[Gail]

I forgive the mispronunciation of chipotle. It's another language after all. And if I were to say I live near Lohs ANG-hel-less rather than the more common LOSS ANN-gell-us, (Los Angeles), people would look at me funny. However, I CANNOT bring myself to mispronounce things to the extreme. We have a street close by called Calle Major (which, correctly, should be close to CAY-yeh my-YORE.) I don't care how people squint at me; I will NOT say Cally Mayer. (shivering violently)

[beckms]

Originally posted by Gail
We have a street close by called Calle Major (which, correctly, should be close to CAY-yeh my-YORE.) I don't care how people squint at me; I will NOT say Cally Mayer. (shivering violently)

Ha. I went to school in Houston, where there are many Hispanic street names. It always made me shudder to hear San Felipe pronounced "San FILL-i-pee".



We're grammar dorks. :p

[Chiffonade]

How about:

pro-NOUN-ciation
orientated
ma-scar-pone (sometimes pronounced mar-sca-pone :rolleyes: )
biz-gotti (AKA biscooooooooooooooootti through the nose)

And for real nails on a blackboard, my (least) favorite...

The Double Negative.

[stefania4]

Originally posted by SandyM

Is she the violent type? ;) :D She has her moments...

Then I hear about a "Tara-ist" and I think, "She has followers? How'd she do that?" :confused: :D

[beckms]

Originally posted by Chiffonade
How about:

pro-NOUN-ciation
orientated
ma-scar-pone (sometimes pronounced mar-sca-pone :rolleyes: )
biz-gotti (AKA biscooooooooooooooootti through the nose)

And for real nails on a blackboard, my (least) favorite...

The Double Negative.

Wait! How DO you pronounce mascarpone? (And I know it's not mar-sca-pone)

Goodness! I've created a monster!

[aggie94]

Originally posted by beckms
Wait! How DO you pronounce mascarpone? (And I know it's not mar-sca-pone)

I think it's mas-kar-POH-nay.

[HejazSunKat]

Originally posted by stefania4
Yes, Terra and erra (for "error") drive me crazy.

Come on up to New England, Stefanie. Everything we say sounds like this.

Dubya definitely inherited his father's ineptitude with language however I have heard him give some excellent speeches. Like the one following 9/11 and the one he did at the Columbia memorial. When he's being serious and steely-eyed he looks very presidential. What bothers me more than his pronunciation is the inappropriate smiling. He will be speaking about some serious subject and throw in some kind of wry grin. Drives me insane.

BTW...anybody catch this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A54629-2003Mar7.html

in the Washington Post about his news conference?

[Chiffonade]

Originally posted by beckms
Wait! How DO you pronounce mascarpone? (And I know it's not mar-sca-pone) Goodness! I've created a monster!

I did that post while I was VERY tired and put the correct pronunciation where the others had an incorrect pronunciation. So here's how you pronounce it:

mah-scar-PONE.

And make sure you roll the "r". ;)

[beckms]

Originally posted by HejazSunKat



BTW...anybody catch this: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A54629-2003Mar7.html

in the Washington Post about his news conference?

Huh...that's pretty nervy to imply that Bush was high during his speech...although, I must admit we made a few jokes of that nature during the speech!

[HejazSunKat]

Originally posted by beckms
Huh...that's pretty nervy to imply that Bush was high during his speech...

I thought so...but that's why I love America. You can say you think the President's on drugs and nothing happens to you. Here they'll throw you in jail if you curse the King.

[Veronica]

Thought this was an interesting article on the whole NOO-klee-uhr, NOO-kyuh-luhr, NOO-kee-yer thing.

October 13, 2002
Confronting `NOO-kyuh-luhr' Proliferation
By JESSE SHEIDLOWER

In recent weeks, throughout the public discussion of Iraq's weapons capabilities, Americans have heard the word "nuclear" pronounced "NOO-kyuh-luhr" by the president, many members of Congress, a general or two and even a few news anchors.

Of the many language controversies that arouse passions, no other - not "hopefully," not the split infinitive, not "most unique" - seems to bother people as much as this. Even though this pronunciation is now included as a variant in all major American dictionaries, a usage panel convened for the "Harper Dictionary of Contemporary Usage" rejected it by a factor of 99 to 1. Steve Kleinedler, the pronunciation editor of the "American Heritage Dictionary," said complaints about this variant are the most frequent comment he gets. Merriam-Webster editors have written a special form letter to respond to those who write in to criticize the inclusion of this pronunciation.

Yet the use of "NOO-kyuh-luhr" is not uncommon, even among prominent and educated people, including four of the nation's last 10 presidents: Dwight D. Eisenhower, who was widely admonished for it; Gerald R. Ford; Jimmy Carter, who did graduate work in nuclear physics, and also used "NOO-kee-yer"; and now George W. Bush.

There are two main explanations for the altered pronunciation. The process of swapping two sounds is common. An old example is the word "third," which used to be "thrid" (like "three"). The pronunciation as "third," with the "r" and the vowel transposed, didn't become standard until the 16th century. A modern example is the word "comfortable"; its usual pronunciation, "CUMF-ter-buhl," doesn't seem to bother anyone, though the "r" and "t" are transposed.

Linguists call this process metathesis, and through it even highly educated people can unknowingly create pronunciations like "INT-ruh-gul" for "integral" or "ir-REV-uh-lent" for "irrelevant." However, metathesis - in the case of "nuclear," the transposition of the "l" with its following vowel - still doesn't answer the "why?"

The real reason is the powerful force of analogy. Words ending in a two-syllable "klee-er" are extremely rare; besides nuclear, the only marginally common such word is cochlear. But a "kyuh-luhr" pronunciation is found in many common words: spectacular, particular, muscular, circular, molecular and others.

Analogy is responsible for a number of linguistic forms, from spelling ("miniscule" for "minuscule," by analogy with "mini-") to pronunciation ("et cetera" becomes the metathetic "EK-set-er-uh," for the many common words with "ex" overwhelm the one beginning with "ets") to grammar (the plural of book should be beech, not books - just as goose becomes geese - but for the influence of the mass of words forming their plural with "s").

SO why is "NOO-kyuh-luhr" so particularly irritating? It's hardly a new pronunciation - the "Oxford English Dictionary's" first example is from 1943, or around the time that nuclear was becoming a familiar word to nonscientists. A driving reason is that it's so common among people who hold prominent positions in society. Most people don't get upset by pronunciations like "PO-lice" or such words as "ain't" as long as these common utterances occur only in dialectal use. But when nonstandard forms like these get used in mainstream contexts, they get noticed. And while folksiness can be acceptable in nontechnical contexts, mispronouncing a technical term is rarely considered O.K. It is viewed as a sign of ignorance, not quaintness.

But in the end, language changes because of the people who use it, not by appealing to any external factor, like spelling or history. People criticizing "NOO-kyuh-luhr" should also condemn "CUMF-ter-bull," yet they don't. Merriam-Webster's form letter about "nuclear" spends only two sentences discussing the word itself: most of the letter is an explanation of why spelling is not a valid basis for determining pronunciation. It offers the example of the words electric, electricity and electrical, in which the one letter "c" represents three different sounds.

In other words, "NOO-kyuh-luhr" is a lost cause, and no amount of pleading on the grounds of technical context or historical novelty can expunge its use. But as Enid Pearsons, the former Random House pronunciation editor, once said, "If we're so upset about 'NOO-kyuh-luhr' proliferation, we can only hope that technology will come up with a new source of energy that we can all pronounce."

Copyright The New York Times Company

[badunnin]

Can we add "expresso" to the list of mispronounced words (and spellings!) that annoy me? I was just reading the "What do you regret buying" thread. Grrr!

[muriel3002]

I've always pronounced it NOO klee ear. And I worked for a division of our company called Nuclear Services.

But on pet peeves - the improper use of the apostrophe! It's everywhere!

You're = you are. If you can't make "you are" a part of that sentence in place of "you're", don't use it.

And TV's and PC's and PDA's. It's not possessive, nor is it a contraction. It's TVs, PCs, or PDAs.

[Jill123]

Originally posted by muriel3002
But on pet peeves - the improper use of the apostrophe! It's everywhere!

You're = you are. If you can't make "you are" a part of that sentence in place of "you're", don't use it.

And TV's and PC's and PDA's. It's not possessive, nor is it a contraction. It's TVs, PCs, or PDAs.

Ahh...a girl after my own heart! :)

I am a grammar FREAK! I'm constantly amazed at the amount of grammar mistakes I see EACH day -- and I'm not talking about remotely complicated ones, like using which/that or what have you -- it's the EASY ones that KILL me!

What I don't get -- it's when people use the apostrophe when they're speaking about the plural -- and not just with acronyms! (For example, "it's the parent's responsibility" -- it's "parents"!!!) ARRGH!!!

Okay, time for my sixth cup of expresso (just kidding! :D) -- espresso! (Again, kidding -- can you believe I get this worked up over apostrophes -- with NO CAFFEINE?!?)

[Grace]

Originally posted by Jill123


Ahh...a girl after my own heart! :)

I am a grammar FREAK! I'm constantly amazed at the amount of grammar mistakes I see EACH day -- and I'm not talking about remotely complicated ones, like using which/that or what have you -- it's the EASY ones that KILL me!

What I don't get -- it's when people use the apostrophe when they're speaking about the plural -- and not just with acronyms! (For example, "it's the parent's responsibility" -- it's "parents"!!!) ARRGH!!!

Okay, time for my sixth cup of expresso (just kidding! :D) -- espresso! (Again, kidding -- can you believe I get this worked up over apostrophes -- with NO CAFFEINE?!?)

Will you hate me if I point out a grammar mistake?? :o :o :p I only decided to do it because it's the topic of discussion, or I'd NEVER do it otherwise!! And of course, I really don't care how well or poorly people write - (mostly it's just typos anyway) - it's the spirit of the conversation I'm most interested in - but anyhow, it's this sentence:

"I'm constantly amazed at the amount of grammar mistakes I see EACH day" Grammatically speaking, it's the NUMBER of grammar mistakes, not the amount...... you use number if it answers the question "how many", and you use amount when it answers the question "how much". So in this example, you'd ask "how many grammar mistakes do you see being made each day", not "how much grammar mistakes". Same with less and fewer. Less is used when it answers the question how much, fewer is used when it answers the quesion how many.

Okay! Grammar lesson over!! And of course, I'm quite sure you knew this already!!! And please take this in the spirit in which it was intended! Anyone and everyone are welcome to point out any and all of my grammar, spelling and/or punctuation mistakes!!! Have a field day, y'all!! :D :D :D

If it's any consolation, I bug my husband about his grammar all the time - he gets pretty sick of me sometimes..... :o :rolleyes:

[swquilts]

What a coincidence! In this Sunday's paper the Parade section Q & A section was asking the same thing about President Bush! Their answer was something about different parts of the country pronounce things differently......

[Jill123]

Originally posted by Grace
Grammatically speaking, it's the NUMBER of grammar mistakes, not the amount...... you use number if it answers the question "how many", and you use amount when it answers the question "how much". So in this example, you'd ask "how many grammar mistakes do you see being made each day", not "how much grammar mistakes". Same with less and fewer. Less is used when it answers the question how much, fewer is used when it answers the quesion how many.

Like I said earlier, I'm not talking about the remotely complicated ones -- just the ones that we should have all learned in, well...grammar school. (pun absolutely intended!) :)

[Grace]

Of course, you're right! I knew what you meant - being the grammar freak that I too, am, I just couldn't resist throwing in my two cents! I really, really, really hope you know I was just ribbing you - absolutely no criticism was meant at all!! I think my tone really doesn't come across in the written form very well. Again - I truly didn't mean to offend - I was just making light of the irony!

[KValley]

There is no "R" in Washington. ("Warshington" AAIIGGHH)

The "s" in Illinois is silent.

It's OR-i-gun, not Or-i-GONE

:D

[kima]

I am not a grammar freak (my DH is!!) but the misuse of the word "lay" drives me crazy. You lay something down .You do not lay on the couch. You lie on the couch. You don't leave dirty laundry laying around, you leave it lying around. You lay the dish on the table!!!
This word is so misused-every day and everywhere!
(Alot of my grammar mistakes are typos...:D :D I swear!!!)

[KValley]

Originally posted by kima
I am not a grammar freak (my DH is!!) but the misuse of the word "lay" drives me crazy. You lay something down .You do not lay on the couch. You lie on the couch. You don't leave dirty laundry laying around, you leave it lying around. You lay the dish on the table!!!
This word is so misused-every day and everywhere!
(Alot of my grammar mistakes are typos...:D :D I swear!!!)

Oh Maureen- I am SOOO bad with lay/lie- I always mess these up. These and further/farther. I KNOW which is correct in which context- I simply can't get my brain and mouth to agree.

will you still speak to me if I lay about lazily lying my dirty dishes on you're counter next to the expresso machine? :D

[kima]

Originally posted by KValley




will you still speak to me if I lay about lazily lying my dirty dishes on you're counter next to the expresso machine? :D

What you don't do your own dishes???? Guess I'll be turning that guest room (which is LYING in wait) into a weight room!:D :D
And I don't have an expresso or a espresso machine-I'd love either one!:p

[badunnin]

Originally posted by kima
I am not a grammar freak (my DH is!!) but the misuse of the word "lay" drives me crazy. You lay something down .You do not lay on the couch. You lie on the couch. You don't leave dirty laundry laying around, you leave it lying around. You lay the dish on the table!!!
This word is so misused-every day and everywhere!
(Alot of my grammar mistakes are typos...:D :D I swear!!!)

But can't you lay yourself down on the couch? (Sorry, I sometimes confuse my English and my German grammar rules. I'm also stuck between American and British spellings. All my English classes in Germany I had to use British grammar and spelling. Grrrr. Now I'm totally confused.)

[HejazSunKat]

Allright, if we're getting into grammatical pet peeves my two favs are: 'prostrate' for the male gland and I have a friend who thinks she has a 'hiatus' hernia. Does that mean it occasionally takes a vacation? :D

[muriel3002]

Originally posted by KValley

The "s" in Illinois is silent.

:D

Speaking of French words. . . we had a good laugh when we travelled through a small Pennsylvania town called Du Bois, only to find out they did not pronounce it "du bwa", but "du boys"! We still laugh about that even though that vacation was probably 6 or 7 years ago.

[beejayw1]

Originally posted by muriel3002
Speaking of French words. . . we had a good laugh when we travelled through a small Pennsylvania town called Du Bois, only to find out they did not pronounce it "du bwa", but "du boys"! We still laugh about that even though that vacation was probably 6 or 7 years ago.

The issue of the pronunciation of place names is a bird of a different feather.

Buena Vista VA is pronounced BYOO nuh vista
Beaufort SC is pronounced BYOO fort

Incidentally, while we're at it, there's a m isused word I find on this board (and everywhere else) from time to time.

People say they aren't 'phased' by something, and they spell it P-H-A-S-E-D. Well, that's a homonym for the correct word:

FAZE
Main Entry: faze
Pronunciation: 'fAz
Function: transitive verb
Inflected Form(s): fazed; faz·ing
Etymology: alteration of feeze (to drive away, frighten), from Middle English fesen, from Old English fEsian to drive away
Date: 1830
: to disturb the composure of : DISCONCERT, DAUNT <nothing fazed her>

Drives me crazy...

[lorilei]

The thing that is SO interesting about this thread, to me, is that it's likely we all have at least one or two grammar "issues" that eep out every once in a while.

And when you think about all the words in our language, it's pretty amazing that any of us know how to use MOST of the words properly :)

[KValley]

Originally posted by beejayw1


The issue of the pronunciation of place names is a bird of a different feather.




Oh, I thought of more.

The Yakima Valley has a very large Hispanic population, so it's no surprise to find Spanish place names. A small hamlet near Yakima is called Buena. But it's pronounced, by EVERYONE

BYOO- ena :eek:

Living in Southeastern Ohio, I came across a few place names that astounded me:

Rio Grande pronounced RYO Grand

Gallipolis pronounced GALL -i -police

Sure I'll think of others...



;)

[slknight]

Originally posted by swquilts
Emeril drives me batty when he says "paster" for pasta

Originally posted by stefania4
Yes, Terra and erra (for "error") drive me crazy.

These are definitely both New England things. The tendency is to add an "r" when there isn't one at the end of the word and to drop the "r" if there is one. Hence, my niece "Hannah" becomes "Hanner" and "pasta" becomes "paster." "Terror" becomes "terra," "car" becomes "cah," et cetera(r).

-slk

[SandyM]

Originally posted by lorilei
And when you think about all the words in our language, it's pretty amazing that any of us know how to use MOST of the words properly :)

Well, I do know how to use words properly.

So their. :p

[lorilei]

Originally posted by SandyM
Well, I do know how to use words properly.

So their. :p


Sandy, when I read this, I just about spewed coffee all over my keyboard.

You are a naughty girl. But I'm determined to be no longer phased by your antics.

[kima]

The verb lay has to take an object-so yes you can lay yourself down on the couch!:)
In fact that's a great idea...:D

[lisas3575]

This is a favorite pastime with my girlfriends. :)

As heard on NPR no less: "highly tooted." :eek:

My old boss had at least one a day that made the hair on my neck stand up (please pardon my spelling):

Hyper-bowl (hyperbole) :eek:

Ahn-tahn-DRAY (entendre) :eek:

FOIL-age (foliage) :eek:

MAHNK (monk) :eek:

Thanks, Diana, for the lesson about fazed. I learned something!

One I see on the BB far, far too often: advise for advice. Advise is pronounced "ad-VIZE." Advice is pronounced "ad-VICE." Thank you.

[lorilei]

And how about the ever popular pronunciation for Target (the department store):

TAR-ZHAY anyone? :D

[erinl]

I haven't read the whole thread, so I don't know if this has been covered: fewer vs. less. Argh, I've seen billboards get it wrong.

If you can count it, you use fewer--if you can't, use less.

I have fewer pennies. I have less money.

[Zinnia]

Just wanted to say that I have friends across the U.S. and some people just pronounce things differently, imo- some depending on where they live. Some can be pretty funny though, I admit...
Some drive me nuts, but if they say something and don't say it like I do, I am not going to correct them-I know what they mean... I think I pronounce things "correctly". If they have a major accent, etc. I will happily help them/tell them the way we talk here.
I have a friend from Washington that says, "I have to warsh the clothes". I have a neighbor that says K-Mark, WalMark instead of K-Mart, WalMart. I grew up in Az. and my Grandpa would say, "Lets go to Tuck-son", instead of Tucson (too-sahn), everytime! I also lived in Hawaii for years and nobody understood/pronounced half of the Islands correctly. In Ak. we have a town called Valdez and it's pronounced Val-Deez, but EVERYONE says, Val-Dez..
I could go on and on... ;)Zinnia

I just hope I put my commas, periods, parentheses, and quotations correctly and didn't offend anyone here with my post! Thats what I am worried about, lol!

[Jill123]

Oooh-oooh...I have more!

I see this a lot on the BB, and I'm 99% sure it's wrong, but maybe it's a regional thing? (Although I'm not sure if spelling is a regional thing? Just pronunciation, right? :confused:)

But it's "fridge" not "frig" or "frige" -- right? (I know why that is confusing, because you spell it refrigerator, so to shorten it, it makes sense that it's "frig" -- but that sounds like the "nice" way to say the f-word -- like "that friggin' dog barked all night" (I feel so bad to have even typed that on the BB -- I'm sorry! -- it was only an example! My mom would be so ashamed!)

But back to weird pronunciations...Growing up in Kansas, you get an earful DAILY. Like pitcher for picture, mill for mail (and all the other long A vowel sounds), wok, tok, chok for walk, talk, chalk. And as someone already mentioned, the dreaded "Did you warsh your hands?"

And Grace -- OF COURSE I knew you were just giving me a hard time. As a matter of fact, I sat there reading your lesson blushing with embarassment!:o :o :o I'm SO ashamed!

[muriel3002]

How about the use of the soft g and hard g.

For example, in the U.S. I would say Elgin with the soft g, making it el jin.

In Ontario, I was corrected - it is el gin - hard g.

Must be regional! Or maybe it's the Queen's English?

[stefania4]

Slightly off-topic, but I was at an outlet mall and a well-known lingerie store was having a "Panties Liquidation Sale." Ewwwww! Didn't anyone proof that before sending it to print???

[jpap]

Here in Georgia we have a street named Ponce de Leon. We pronounce it Ponce duh Lee-on. Being a native I have never really thought about, and there is a town named Lafayette, we say La fay ette. It actually drives me crazy when news reporters(transplants) pronounce them correctly. I guess I'm stuck in my ways. Janet

[stefania4]

Originally posted by jpap
Here in Georgia we have a street named Ponce de Leon. We pronounce it Ponce duh Lee-on. Being a native I have never really thought about, and there is a town named Lafayette, we say La fay ette. It actually drives me crazy when news reporters(transplants) pronounce them correctly.Yes, I was immediately corrected on both of those when I moved to Georgia; also that the Houston Mill House is actually the How-ston Mill House. And back in Virginia "Staunton" isn't pronounced like it's spelled, it's pronounced "Stanton."

[MKSquared]

I want to play, too! :)

You lose weight; you do not [/i]loose[/i] weight.
It's Cincinnati, not Cincinatti. (Double the N, not the T!)

Here in Ah-hi-ah (if you're in the southern part of Ohio, anyway), you'll hear of cities like KValley mentioned:
Rio Grande = Rye-Oh-Grand
Lima = Lye-mah
Bellefountaine = Bell-FOUN-tan
Newark = Nerk
(and for the record, Cleveland is on the banks of the Cuy-ah-HAH-ah, not Cuy-ah-HOHG-ah, if you're to say it with the proper Cleveland accent.)

And while I'm on it ...
Bruschetta should be said Bru-SKET-ta, not Bru-SHET-ta :)

I'm so embarassed to learn that I've been saying mascarpone wrong all this time. :eek: :o What's next? You'll be telling me it's sher-BET, not sher-BERT. ;)

[MrsReber]

How interesting! SandyM covered my pet peeve- their, there, and they're. I haven't met many people who know which one to use!

I have a friend who sends me all this interesting information on words. As I was reading this thread, she sent me this (which was also a pet peeve of mine, especially when I was working as a vet tech):

To spay an animal is to sterilize her by the removal of her ovaries. Spay has
its origin in spatha, Latin for "broadsword" and it traveled into English via
the Middle French espeer, meaning "to cut with a sword" before appearing in
English during the 1400s.


The past tense and past participle of spay is spayed. By the late 1600s, spayed
had given birth to an altered form of the present tense spelled spade that is
synonymous with spay. As you might expect, folks who prefer spade to spay tend
to use spaded for the past forms. These days, both the present tense spade and
the past form spaded are still heard, but seldom seen; they are not considered
standard and rarely appear in edited work.


Don't think we've forgotten about terminating the reproductive capability of the
male animal. The usual term for that is castrate, meaning "to deprive of the
testes." Castrate descends from Latin and has kin in both the Greek verb
meaning, "to split," and the Sanskrit phrase meaning, "he slaughters." Since
everyone is cringing anyway, we'll point out that castrate is sometimes used of
females as well as males. Neuter, from the Latin word meaning "neither," can
also be applied to operations performed on either sex.


We had "spay" kits at the hospital and we "spayed" pets, we didn't "spade" them and they were not "spaded".

[Little Bit]

What an interesting thread! :)

My dad has some habits of speech that he just won't break, since he's convinced he's correct and that's the way he was trained. He routinely pronounces certain things with a hard 'g' not a soft one. Los Angeles and La Guardia are two that spring to mind.

And don't get him started on scientific names. Jurassic? He'll talk for ages about how it's 'supposed' to be pronounced 'Yurassic' etc.

And as for lay/lie:
He always says, "Just remember that 'to lay', takes two."
(heh, heh, heh.) ;)

[MKSquared]

Originally posted by Little Bit
My dad has some habits of speech that he just won't break, since he's convinced he's correct and that's the way he was trained. He routinely pronounces certain things with a hard 'g' not a soft one. Los Angeles and La Guardia are two that spring to mind.

:confused: But doesn't La Guardia have a hard G? It's GWAR-dee-ah, not JWHA-di-a, right? I dunno - this thread's been teaching me some things. :)

[claire797]

Originally posted by Little Bit
What an interesting thread! :)

My dad has some habits of speech that he just won't break, since he's convinced he's correct and that's the way he was trained. He routinely pronounces certain things with a hard 'g' not a soft one. Los Angeles and La Guardia are two that spring to mind.



La Guardia???? Wouldn't Gward-dee-ah be considered a hard 'g'?

[beckms]

Originally posted by MrsReber
We had "spay" kits at the hospital and we "spayed" pets, we didn't "spade" them and they were not "spaded".

OMG!!! How funny! I'm a vet tech, too, and I HATE it when people say spaded! It just seems ignorant. But then again, if you're not in the profession, I guess it's forgiveable. :D

[Little Bit]

Oh, oops! The "La Guardia" thing isn't the hard 'g.' He pronounces "La Guardia" as La 'gard-eea' (without a 'w' sound in the middle. That bugs me too, lol!!!

[tkeyla71]

This thread is great!

My dear late Dad used to say, "eye-talian" for Italian.


Those of us who were born and raised in Chicago say "chi-caw-go" and it seems all others say "chi-cah-go"...we can instantly tell who's "one of us" !

[RebeccaT]

My grandfather in Biloxi, MS, goes to the BOO-fay (buffet) at the Grand Casino once a week when they have their senior-citizen's discount...

:p :D

[Dahlia]

Originally posted by lorilei
The pronunciation bugs me. But that has GOT to be a regional (mis)pronunciation or something. He's not the only person I've heard pronounce it that way... in fact, in some places, I would venture a guess that it's the ONLY way the word is said.


Before the word [nuclear] was butchered by the president, I got numbed to the mispronounciation by Keifer Sutherland's (sp?) pronounciation of the same word as Jack Bauer on Fox's TV show 24. I cringed everytime he said it. I honestly thought "Doesn't a SINGLE person on the set know how to pronounce the word correctly? Why would they let him keep on using the wrong pronounciation." It drove me nuts!!!!

I guess by the time the president got to it, I had already given up on willing people to get it right. I mean... if the pres himself can't get it right, and he's got advisors left and right...

I've been lurking a lot lately, but when this topic popped on the board, I had to de-lurk and vent. :D

Dahlia

[KristinK]

I'm late responding too - I originally didn't have anything to add to the Bush's pronunciation of 'nuclear' and just now noticed that the thread had taken a turn. So you can add me to the list of grammar freaks - in college, friends would bring their papers to me instead of the writing center!

Anyway, I just have to say that my Mom is so bad. She likes to add an extra 'r' to 'garage' - so she makes it 'gar-ARGE.' And she always jumbles up the words for Mexican foods - like 'torti-LAS' instead of 'torti-YAS' and 'ques-KA-dillas' instead of 'ques-A-dillas' (where does she see a K?). So needless to say, she gets a lot of teasing from all of us.

And I'll toss another one out for everyone - 'effect' is a noun; 'affect' is the verb.

[slknight]

Originally posted by KristinK


And I'll toss another one out for everyone - 'effect' is a noun; 'affect' is the verb.

Actually, this isn't entirely true. "Effect" is also a verb. It means to bring about.

Here's a note from dictionary.com:

Usage Note: Affect and effect have no senses in common. As a verb affect is most commonly used in the sense of “to influence” (how smoking affects health). Effect means “to bring about or execute”: layoffs designed to effect savings. Thus the sentence These measures may affect savings could imply that the measures may reduce savings that have already been realized, whereas These measures may effect savings implies that the measures will cause new savings to come about.

[lisas3575]

Originally posted by KristinK
And she always jumbles up the words for Mexican foods - like 'torti-LAS' instead of 'torti-YAS' and 'ques-KA-dillas' instead of 'ques-A-dillas' (where does she see a K?).

My mom likes to order chimi-CHANG-gahs. :rolleyes:

[aggie94]

On the topic of regional pronunciations (or more accurately, MISpronunciations) of things, voir dire is a commonly used legal term to describe the process of picking a jury. Those who pronounce it correctly would call it "vwah deer." When I moved to Texas, I found out that people here pronounce it "vore (rhyming with four) dyer." :eek: Yes, they know it's not correct. No, they don't care. And yes, EVERYONE does it. If you don't, they know you don't practice here. I cringe everytime I have to say it. :rolleyes:

[sunberst]

Originally posted by SandyM
I'll admit, I've never heard anyone say chi-POHL-tay before, but this one had me scratching my head.

Perhaps it was her southern twang? this is exactly how i say it and i am not southern. :)

i did not know that so many people get so annoyed by mispronounced words. words do not bother me. you can say whatever you want however you want around me and it does not make a difference. honestly i do not notice when people prononce words incorrectly. i guess i do not care to analyze someone's speech. a word is just a word is just a word...

afterall, i do not believe in writing capital letters or some other punctuations. i follow e.e. cummings style. :)

[MrsReber]

DH's favorite Bush-ism is "strategery". I'm not sure when he said it, but DH likes to use it in conversation. By the way, he's a Bush supporter, he just likes to poke fun.

[MrsReber]

Originally posted by valchemist
Actually, I don't think Bush ever said "strategery." I think it is just a word that Rush Limbaugh made up. He uses it for fun, not because he really thinks it is a word.

That could very well be. I don't pay much attention to Rush Limbaugh! Maybe I wasn't paying attention to DH when he was telling me about the origin of the word ;)?

[valchemist]

Actually, I don't think Bush ever said "strategery." I think it is just a word that Rush Limbaugh made up. He uses it for fun, not because he really thinks it is a word.

[claire797]

Originally posted by MrsReber
DH's favorite Bush-ism is "strategery". I'm not sure when he said it, but DH likes to use it in conversation. By the way, he's a Bush supporter, he just likes to poke fun.

Rush Limbaugh has adopted it too. He admits that he loves that word and uses it all the time.

[claire797]

Originally posted by valchemist
Actually, I don't think Bush ever said "strategery." I think it is just a word that Rush Limbaugh made up. He uses it for fun, not because he really thinks it is a word.

I don't know if Bush said it, but I'm 100% positive Dana Carvey said it on Saturday Night live.

Rush does use it for fun but he has said several times that he *loves* the word and thinks it should be in the dictionary.

[mochadelsol]

Here is one of my mother's best "bev-room" for bedroom:) I could add more but I'll leave my dear mom alone. I think I've tortured her enough through the years.

[badunnin]

I have a few pet-peeves. First, the difference between good and well. Second, when my father says he is going "acrosst" the street. Grrr. Where does he get that "t" from? Third, when I'm chatting online, or in an e-mail, and people use "kool." And it's not just teenagers! Sometimes I can see abbreviating (not sure I spelled that right) things, like wb for welcome back or np for no problem. It saves typing strokes, and in a chat environment, I can sympathise. But kool?

[SandyM]

Originally posted by mochadelsol
Here is one of my mother's best "bev-room" for bedroom:) I could add more but I'll leave my dear mom alone. I think I've tortured her enough through the years.

This reminded me......

My mom says "ministrating" for menstruating, and "prostrate" for prostate. It doesn't make me crazy - just makes me giggle. :)

[lorilei]

I've always been a grammar freak -- but am also fascinated by the linguistic aspect of "changing language" and the idea that local dialects are shaped in so many different ways. It's really cool that language grows, changes, and mutates. It means that the language is LIVING :) And I think most of the examples we've cited are proof that people have taken language and made it their own -- which is pretty cool, and not always a matter of ignorance.

My emphasis on grammar always drove my husband nuts -- so he started purposely misusing words to be funny. Some of his favorites are:

DELICATESSON -- as in "Wow, truffles are a real delicatesson in Wisconsin!"

Interchanging the words SHALLOT, SCALLOP and SCALLION. You never know what you're having for dinner when he cooks ;)

[SandyM]

Originally posted by lorilei
And I think most of the examples we've cited are proof that people have taken language and made it their own -- which is pretty cool, and not always a matter of ignorance.

Bingo. (I thought I'd use that today, instead of Ditto. :p )

[stefania4]

Originally posted by badunnin
when I'm chatting online, or in an e-mail, and people use "kool." And it's not just teenagers! Sometimes I can see abbreviating (not sure I spelled that right) things, like wb for welcome back or np for no problem. It saves typing strokes, and in a chat environment, I can sympathise. But kool? I've seen "bo-k" on wedding boards for "bouquet." Ugh! Even more egregiously, I fear that there are people who think "prolly" is a word. I finally had to ask someone what it meant and determined that it's a bastardization of "probably." Nails down a chalkboard, I tell you.

[MaryH]

Originally posted by stefania4
Yes, I was immediately corrected on both of those when I moved to Georgia; also that the Houston Mill House is actually the How-ston Mill House. And back in Virginia "Staunton" isn't pronounced like it's spelled, it's pronounced "Stanton."

See and I was going to say that I have an uncle in New York who once asked me how do you say "Houston Street". Now for New Yorkers its, how-ston, but for "everyone" else (maybe west coast people) its hu-ston (like Texas).

As for voir dire, it's French, pronouce it the way they do. And it's not just a Texas thing, I can't tell you how many CA. attorneys mis-pronounce it all the time.

Here's my pet peeve - you "marinate" something overnight but what you put it in is a "marinade".

What fascinates me though are acronyms that have become such a part of the language that people forget that they originally stood for something:

examples:

POSH - port outboard, starboard home (these were the best cabins on the ships that traveled from England down around Cape Horn and only the wealthiest could afford them)

SNAFU - situation normal, all f**ked up (from Vietnam)

F**K - (it'll edited me if I don't do this): For unlawful carnal knowledge

SCUBA - self contained underwater breathing apparatus

I'm sure there are more but's that's all I can think of right now.

And for all you grammar people check out, http://www.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/errors.html#errors (Someone posted this last time, but it's a great site.)

[badunnin]

Originally posted by MaryH


F**K - (it'll edited me if I don't do this): For unlawful carnal knowledge



Now, I've heard that this word comes from the term "fornication under consent of the king."

Edited to say that we may both be wrong. Check out this (http://www.snopes.com/language/acronyms/****.htm) website. (I'd cut and paste it here, but too much editing would go on. :) )

[KristinK]

Originally posted by mochadelsol
Here is one of my mother's best "bev-room" for bedroom:)
This also reminded me - the annoying woman I work with says - quite seriously - "birf-day" :confused:

[MaryH]

Originally posted by badunnin


Now, I've heard that this word comes from the term "fornication under consent of the king."

Edited to say that we may both be wrong. Check out this (http://www.snopes.com/language/acronyms/****.htm) website. (I'd cut and paste it here, but too much editing would go on. :) )

I've tried a couple of times, but I can't get to the site. I get a message saying that mny server can't find it. Any ideas?

[MKSquared]

Yup. :) The editing software edited the link. Instead of **** in the URL, it needs to be the word whose origins you're researching. ;)

[Jill123]

I just thought of one!

Our managing partner calls breakfast bref-das. DH and I have a running joke -- I call it bref-das now and he calls it breffas (it's how Shaq says it in the McDonald's Big Breakfast commercials). It's weird, I know (the things you do to keep laughter in a marriage!!) :rolleyes:

[HejazSunKat]

This thread is killing me. :D

I've got one for you Mary...you forgot:

FUBAR - F**ked Up Beyond All Repair

If we think the natives mangle the mother tongue, try it as a second language. Per his time card one of our attorneys (a native Arabic speaker) spent half an hour one day: 'Checking the second virgin' (dare I ask what he did with the first?). Uh...make that v-e-r-s-i-o-n.

[Little Bit]

And how many others who're having fun with this thread have read Winston Churchill's History of the English Speaking Peoples ?? Hmmm??? :) Fascinating stuff. :)

[badunnin]

Originally posted by MKSquared
Yup. :) The editing software edited the link. Instead of **** in the URL, it needs to be the word whose origins you're researching. ;)

I'll have to admit that the editing software is very thorough!

[VictoriaL]

Originally posted by muriel3002


Speaking of French words. . . we had a good laugh when we travelled through a small Pennsylvania town called Du Bois, only to find out they did not pronounce it "du bwa", but "du boys"! We still laugh about that even though that vacation was probably 6 or 7 years ago.


Egads. Why didn't I read this thread earlier? My favorite topic-- mispronunciation! Nails on the blackboard for me is when DH insists on saying "rhododendrem" or "wheelbarrel". After almost 20 years of my correcting him, he still pronounces these words wrong only to annoy me!!!

And, uh, I grew up in DuBois! There's a bit of a stink about weather it's pronounced "DuBois" or "DuBois" with "Bois" being pronounced as spelled with the "s" on the end. And, less common, is Du-Boys (as muriel13002 discovered). Amusingly, my computer spell-check wants to change the word to "dubious". Which I agree with since I hit out of there to go to college and now only go back for short visits! My sister is married to the great-grandson of the founder of the town (yes, she's one of The DuBois Family now :rolleyes: ) and they pronounce it with the emphasis on the "bois", with the full "s" sound on the end. So I guess that it's the correct way-- but only in DuBois! :D

[Elizabeth B]

This thread is so funny - I thought I was the only person who was irritated at nuk-u-ler!! I can also admit that when I first heard President Bush speaking about "terrorists", I heard it as "tourists" and was wondering what the tourists had done (silly me)!

On chipotle, only recently was I embarrassed to discover I'd been spelling and pronouncing it incorrectly (probably thanks to all of you). Now I notice it spelled wrong all the time - especially on restaurant menus!

Thanks for a great laugh at the end of my day!!

[buffygirl]

What fun, here are a few of mine:

People who think the word "orientate" is a word! The verb is "orient" as in "Let me get myself oriented" not orientated. Drives me nuts.

My dad also has a few. He refers to a drivers license as though it is plural. "Have you gone to get those yet?" meaning my drivers license. Ugh. It is just one thing!

He also refers to K Mart and Wal Mart as Kmarts and Walmarts. Gotta love him though!:)

BK

[Chefzhat]

Thought I'd pop in to say that we have some neighbors that call their close relatives COUSINTS. ahem. What IS that?

Debie

[MaryH]

Originally posted by buffygirl
What fun, here are a few of mine:

People who think the word "orientate" is a word! The verb is "orient" as in "Let me get myself oriented" not orientated. Drives me nuts.


Let me add to that "conversate." This drives me nuts. You have a conversation with somone but you don't conversate. (I have no idea where this came from but have heard it enough to make me think it is fairly common.) Oh and "supposably." The word is supposedly.

[MKSquared]

I forgot the worst one - grow the economy.

I understand that a portfolio may grow, or an economy might grow (although even that's stretching it) - but I don't understand how you grow a portfolio. (Do you put little seeds in the ground, water them, and watch them sprout up into stocks?)

[Leanne]

Originally posted by gianttrev

I'm reminded by that Simpson's Episode when they visit the apple farm, and Homer turns to Lisa, "It's pronounced NOOK-YOU-LER honey, Nook-you-ler"


I thought it was a Simpson's thread too. :)

[badunnin]

Originally posted by MKSquared
I forgot the worst one - grow the economy.

I understand that a portfolio may grow, or an economy might grow (although even that's stretching it) - but I don't understand how you grow a portfolio. (Do you put little seeds in the ground, water them, and watch them sprout up into stocks?)

Mary Kate - for more on growing stocks, please reference the gardening thread.:D

[MKSquared]

Originally posted by badunnin
Mary Kate - for more on growing stocks, please reference the gardening thread.:D

No, you've got it all wrong! :D I'm not talking about vegetables FOR stocks ... ;)

[claire797]

You guys should love this.

http://hcs.harvard.edu/~golder/dialect/maps.php

[mrcoffee]

"I feel badly." Correct usage is "I feel bad". That is, unless you have a faulty sense of touch.

"I need to loose weight." It's "lose"! Loose rhymes with noose. Lose rhymes with ooze.

"Alot" It's two words, people -- a and lot. Count 'em. TWO!