vaccines and thimerosal

[beacooker]

Salon has a big story today about the link between thimerosal in vaccines and autism. http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2005/06/16/thimerosal/index.html?source=RSS&vm=r

I have heard of this before, but I always thought that it was just a case of people being overly alarmist. After reading this, I'm not so sure.

One part of the article that does raise a question for me is this one:
Searching for children who had not been exposed to mercury in vaccines -- the kind of population that scientists typically use as a "control" in experiments -- Olmsted scoured the Amish of Lancaster County, Penn., who refuse to immunize their infants. Given the national rate of autism, Olmsted calculated that there should be 130 autistics among the Amish. He found only four. One had been exposed to high levels of mercury from a power plant. The other three -- including one child adopted from outside the Amish community -- had received their vaccines.

That is certainly a shocking little nugget, but I would like to know the total number of people in their control group who had been vaccinated or exposed to mercury. Maybe I'll try and track down the full study.

This bb is full of people with cool heads - what do you think of the possible link between autism and vaccinations?

[tbb113]

I'm not sure what I think about the link. Truthfully it never entered my mind when my sons were younger and even if they were little today, I would vacinate them. The risk of catching and dying from a childhood disease that still exist to me outweigh the risk of autism.

[erinl]

I agree with Tyra. The benefits outweigh the risks--if indeed there is a link.

[beacooker]

Just to clarify, I believe that most childhood vaccines don't contain thimerasol anymore. And both of my kids have been and will be vaccinated. I'm not looking for validation of my choices, or advice on what to do about my kids in the future. I am just curious about what others think about the possible link, and the science behind it.

[sillybeans]

I've read the full story about the Amish, and it's impossible to draw conclusions, because they are a very insular people--in other words, they don't mix their gene pool. So they may not have a high incidence of autism, but they have a higher-than-average rate of other genetically linked diseases.

Given the re-emergence of polio, whooping cough, etc, and the research that has discounted any link, I personally would vaccinate. The initial research has been debunked and was, IMHO, a vastly irresponsible and alarmist conclusion based on the quality of the study. There are millions of vaccinated children who are perfectly normal.

I work in the medical field and find that people are very ready to point to a scapegoat for their tragedies--they cannot seem to accept that events can be random (or in this case, likely a bad roll of the genetic dice).

And vaccines DO NOT contain thermerisol, at least not in the US.

Tracy

[tbb113]

Anne: to go back to your original question, I think the increase in autism has a lot of components. Some are that the definition has been changed, more doctors (and parents) are aware of this, etc.

I would think if it was vaccines, it would have showed up in earlier generations (I was pretty well vaccinated when I was a kid 40 years ago). I think if anything it would be a hormonal or environmental issue.

[Beth H]

I read the Salon story this morning. I've always been quite skeptical of the connection between vaccines and autism - but some of the things in the article, particularly the explosion of autism just as children were receiving more and more vaccines, made me think. Apparently autism recently has increased dramatically in places like China, too, where US-made vaccines still contain the thermerisol.

And vaccines DO NOT contain thermerisol, at least not in the US.

It only has been recently, though, that thermerisol has not been part of US vaccines. This article really focused on kids born in a certain period from the late 80's up through 2003 - as more and more vaccines have been added to the protocol (and many of those vaccines contained thermerisol).

[stacy7272]

Originally posted by sillybeans
And vaccines DO NOT contain thermerisol, at least not in the US.

Tracy
The flu vaccine does, although that is not part of the usual round of childhood vaccinations. The flumist version does not and I'm really hoping that becomes more widely available.

I got DS a flu vaccine when he was around 27 months old because we had a new baby in the house but now that DS will be 5 during the next flu season and DD will be 3, I'm debating on whether or not to get it for them. They are older so they are better able to handle both the thimerisol AND the flu.

BUT, as with most vaccines and parents who decide not to get them - if my child were to get the flu, I would REALLY wish that I had gotten it for them.

[Beth H]

The flu vaccine does, although that is not part of the usual round of childhood vaccinations.

I believe Thermisol is used to preserve multi-dose vaccines (like the flu). This is why vaccines sent to countries like China and India have it - so that widespread vaccination in poor areas is easier.

[Kristilyn1]

well, I don't know what to think. I work with kids with autism. My first question is: what year did vaccines stop including Thermisol? I'm with early intervention so the kids I see are between the ages of 2 & 3 and we are seeing a LOT of cases, newly diagnosed cases. Also, why is autism so much more prevalent in boys? (only 1 in 4 cases are girls). Also, statistically you have a greater chance of having more than one child with autism--why is that?
Part of the explosion in kids with autism is that more and more kids are being labeled on the spectrum, I would say that the Amish may not be diagnosing ALL their kids, or we are diagnosing way too many as one reason for the discrepancy. Fresh water fish are loaded with mercury---does anyone know---do the Amish eat a lot of fresh water fish? If so, wouldn't that lead to more cases if mercury was to blame?

Also, why do kids with autism typically develop normally and then gradually start to decline?

I wonder these same things myself and have no answers--but I don't think anyone has really stumbled onto the magic bullet yet.

Kristi

[sillybeans]

Oooops--I meant pediatric vaccines. Typing between meetings...

Sorry.
Tracy

[CompassRose]

I have no idea why thimerosal was ever used as a medical preservative. It seems to be a highly sensitising substance in the body. When I was 18, and had been wearing contacts for two years, I put them in one day and my eyeballs swelled out like golfballs; emergency visit to the eye doctor, who took one look and said, "Ah, you're reacting to the thimerosal."

Needless to say, I do not get flu vaccines. I can only imagine the result. Anyway, if not autism, I could certainly see that putting something like that into children's bodies could well have adverse effects on the immune system.

As for why certain kids get it and not others, and why it runs in families, I expect that -- whatever the cause -- the degree of sensitivity to it is genetically related in some way. I assume the same is true of most environmentally-caused diseases, like cancer and the like; your cells might be more vulnerable than your buddy's cells, so even though you both spray the same pesticide or whatever, you end up tumour-ridden while he doesn't.

[Beth H]

My first question is: what year did vaccines stop including Thermisol?

According to the article, 2003.

The article did point out other potential sources of mercury, especially fish.

Also, why do kids with autism typically develop normally and then gradually start to decline?

Well, that's certainly one of the circumstantial arguments for the vaccine theory - that kids begin demonstrating symptoms after the big rounds of vaccines when they are older babies.

I have no idea why thimerosal was ever used as a medical preservative.

The Salon piece certainly had some frightening stuff in it about thimersol - how toxic it was in lab tests, etc.