Sticky Situation.....

[KimKelly]

I have a sticky situation that I'm not quite sure how to handle and I'm looking for some input on the issue...

My son is 9 years old and we've always raised him with the thought that "honesty is the best policy". So.... today, he had 3 friends over and another friend called. This other friend "X" is fairly persistent with the calls, he has played with my son the last 4 days in a row and my son likes to play with other people too (goodness... this sounds like dating!). So when X called, he said he was busy. X asked what my son was doing and my son said that his other friends were over (they all know each other) and that he just wanted to play with them. The other boys concurred and didn't really want X to join them.

So now X's mom is upset and says that it is not fair that the boys didn't include her son. My son and the other 2 boys had been together for a number of hours and only had about an hour left. This is the first time they had all played this summer.

What do I say to her? What do I say to my son? I don't think that he should have to include everyone at every time, but this is a pretty good friend of his and now X and his mom have hurt feelings. My son says "But mom... I just told him the truth". Ugh! I so don't like situations like this!

On one hand I fully understand the desire to not have someone around at a particular time, but the adult politeness in me says that they should have included him anyway.

How do we handle this in the future?

I've already talked to the 3 boys at my house and asked them to think how they would have felt if one of them had called and was told that they weren't welcome with the others. They all cringed a bit and stated, "Well.. we just didn't want to play with him today".

??????

Kim

[lorilei]

THis is a tough one. I don't have kids -- but this situation hit home.

Thinking of it from my POV only -- I'd rather have hurt feelings than be lied to. So, from that perspective, I'd have a hard time telling your son that what he did was wrong.

I think it is a tough lesson to learn how NOT to hurt others' feelings without lying. Most adults aren't good at this either. Maybe most people would rather hear something pleasant than face the truth.

Would it be prudent to let your son know that he doesn't always need to explain WHY he might not want to do things with a friend? That he can just be busy?



Sorry - that's not much help is it?

[Goin' Coastal]

I don't think there is anything wrong with a little white lie in lieu of hurting someone's feelings. What's wrong with saying "My Mom says I can't play right now, but I can play later" (or tomorrow, or whatever).

[colleency]

Hmm. If they were adults, then X would have been being rude, because if you say you're busy, you shouldn't be required to say why. That is really tough though, and it's even a problem with adults.

I think I'd kind of go with what Goin' Coastal said. Your son does sound old enough to distinguish a white lie from a regular lie.

That is a tough situation.

[blazedog]

Kim -- I agree that it's a sticky situation but part of learning social graces is learning the social lie -- i.e. the lie we tell so as to not hurt other's feelings when the truth serves no purpose.

In this case, your son saying he was busy was the truth -- there really was no need to elaborate on that. In real life, most people use the "busy" excuse to spare feelings.

To successfully maneuver life, one really has to be attuned to these kinds of things -- absolute blunt honesty is not the best policy in many situations. Don't we all keep some things private even if asked? Don't we all tell polite social lies?

Again, I believe in honesty and ethics -- HONESTLY :D but I certainly do lie especially when the truth is hurtful and serves no particular purpose -- in this case, nothing was gained except hurt feelings.

THe pushy boy lacks social graces too obviously as most of us learn to pick up social cues -- i.e. do we actually press people when we hear a vague, sorry I'm busy?

[LaraW]

Originally posted by KimKelly
So now X's mom is upset and says that it is not fair that the boys didn't include her son.

You know what - maybe its not "fair" but life isn't always fair.

I don't think that he has to include X every time - its not like they don't play together at other times, etc, and he wasn't inviting the other kids over when he and X played the last few days?

I like Lori's suggestion about he doesn't have to explain why he's busy - just that he is busy.

I agree that I'd rather be told the truth and maybe have my feelings hurt than be lied to.

Its hard to be in that situation, and its hard to be the one that the other kids don't want to play with - I can certainly sympathize with that. Maybe your son can call X tomorrow and invite him over to play to show him that he still wants to be friends with him.

[krhm]

Kim, I hate it when this happens. I think that it was handled appropriately, but I understand that you feel uncomfortable about their response. I've always told my daughter to suggest an alternative day to play ("I've got so-and-so over now, but maybe on Friday we can go to the pool"), and that helps. Our neighborhood is very close-knit, so any type of white lie would most likely have been exposed immediately, but there are simply times when I don't want 5 kids running around or when she just needs a break from someone. Suggesting an alternative play date lets the person know that it's situational and not permanent.

I think it would be almost impossible to get a 9-year old to distinguish between times it's okay to tell a small white lie and times when it isn't.

Kari

[Laura]

Honestly, I think your son handled it fine, and the other mom needs to get over it. Your son is not required to play with "X" every day or invite "X" over each time he plays. I would simply tell the other mom that your son really enjoys playing with "X" as evidenced by the fact that they had played together for the past four days, but he wanted to spend some time with his other friends today. Make a play date in the future and hopefully she will let it go.

[HejazSunKat]

Originally posted by KimKelly
So now X's mom is upset and says that it is not fair that the boys didn't include her son.

I also think your son did just fine and I don't think the other mom should have called you. She should have let the kids work it out for themselves and taken it as an opportunity to chat with her son about the sometimes-we-don't-get-included-in-things business. He's going to have to learn eventually that he has to share his friends.

It never gets any easier even as adults. I have a very sensitive BIL/SIL that we tend to walk on eggshells around because their feelings get hurt easily and they see phantom conspiracies to exclude them all the time. If one branch of the family gets together without them for some casual, spur of the moment thing (pizza or a movie on a Friday for example) which might not be possible to include them in because they live 1/2 an hour away we're careful to make sure nobody mentions it.

I think krhm's idea of suggesting an alternative get together is terrific. It preserves your son's right to direct his own social life but at the same time is sensitive to someone else's natural feelings of being excluded. A great idea.

[KimKelly]

Thanks Guys! I feel much better about the whole thing. I agree that the Mom should "get over it". She is a difficult person, and honestly, if it weren't here I don't think it would have been an issue.

I did talk to my son and say that he can just be "busy". I like the suggestion of "Maybe we can play tomorrow?" and will talk to him about that as well (the boys are up at one of the other boys houses... they had to walk right past X's house...:o ).

Social graces are difficult. I can't tell you how many times as an adult I've not wanted to invite someone but did so I didn't hurt their feelings. I think this is a lesson for me as well.

Thanks again for the input. As always it helps!

Kim

[Kristilyn1]

yes, that is sticky. Nine is a tough age. One thing you want to make sure with all the boys involved is that they don't let this newfound "power" go to their heads. (not saying they are, it might occur to them later in that unformed way that boys seem to come up with "good" ideas). I think your son handled if fine. I don't agree with teaching nine year olds white lies, if your boy is anything like mine--he would have a hard time doing it right and then you'd get to add telling his friend a lie on top of hurting his feelings.

I do agree with the fact that he should be able to say "I'm busy" and have that be the end of it. Great idea to suggest another date for them to play, that way it is clear that they are still friends. As far as the other mom--it's easy to get your feelings hurt on behalf of your kids. I'd explain to her firmly, that your son enjoys her son, you like having him over, etc. but that sometimes HER son may have kids over and not include your son, and same for you. Make it clear to her that you are not allowing or encouraging any kind of clique to start that excludes her son. If she still doesn't "get it" then next time her son comes over, explain to him that YOU like him, your SON likes him but that sometimes he might not be included. I think her choice of words--"fair" is very interesting. I mean think about it--it's YOUR house, what the heck does she mean by it's not fair that her son was not invited over? Overstepping her boundaries a little bit aren't we?

Kristi

[DmOrtega]

Tough choice... it's good to hear that your son can make the choice for himself. My ds has this situation come up a lot. His freinds all want to be included but he doesn't always want to spend the time with them. This doesn't mean that they are not freinds, just that he needs his own space. If the other child is feeling hurt then it's the parents resposiblity to teach that child that there are times that he won't be invited to play and vice versa. How about playing with another freind? Your son did nothing wrong. The childs mother needs to step back and let them work it out themselves. If that fails, then take the lead, as in "mom says there are enough kids here now, maybe later or another day.". That works also.

[Chefzhat]

Good grief, that mom needs to get a life. :rolleyes: The idea of her calling you to nag about her precious baby not being invited. I hope you said "gee, I can't believe you're getting involved in this. I'm sure the boys are able to work this out themselves."

Can you tell that we had some neighbors like this??? Had to move to get away from them. It got so bad that the mom actually came over to our house, rang our doorbell, asked for my son, then proceeded to ream him out over some slight against her child. ???? I not so politely told her that she was not thinking straight right that minute and that perhaps she should go home and cool off.

Ugh.

Your kiddo did the right thing. You don't owe anyone excuses. He told the truth. Not his fault the other kiddo has "issues".

[KimKelly]

So...as I was telling my son, sticky (or uncomfortable) situations happen to adults too!

Today we were at a birthday party. It was for a little girl who is in my Girl Scouct Troop (I'm the leader) and who my daughter went to school with, but someone she has only played with once outside of school. So they aren't really good friends, more like aquaintencences. My daughters birthday party is in two weeks and we didn't invite this little girl - we only invited friends who she plays frequently with. So........ as I'm standing there with the birthday girls mom and two other moms (the other two mom's daughters were invited to my daughters party) one of the mom says "So... what would your daughter like for her birthday??? I just loved the invitation you made!" I could see that the one mom felt bad knowing that they have obviously not received the invite. So what did I do? Nothing... I just stood there uncomfortable as all get out and changed the subject! Geez.... maybe I need a lesson from my son! What would you have done???????

My son enjoyed the story on the way home and got a good laugh!

Kim

[blazedog]

Kim -- Points out the lack of social graces on the part of the other woman. I think at a very early age, civilized people learn NOT to mention parties in the presence of other people unless they KNOW the other person has been invited.

Regarding what you could have done -- probably nothing as it was an awkward situation brought upon by the idiocy of the other woman. I would have wished for the floor to open personally to take me away and a lightning bolt to strike the big mouth.

Regarding your son, I don't expect 9 year old kids to be paragons of Emily Post but you can of course use it as an object lesson in why you don't mention parties in front of others. I do think kids can absorb stuff in terms of kindness and thoughfulness which is really what social graces/etiquette is about -- behaving in a manner that takes into account other people's feelings.

In my earlier post, I perhaps didn't articulate exactly what I meant -- I thought your son did fine by saying he was busy but I tried to point out that you could let your son know that he doesn't have to feel pressured into adding every little detail when those details aren't the other's person's business.

[KimKelly]

Originally posted by blazedog

In my earlier post, I perhaps didn't articulate exactly what I meant -- I thought your son did fine by saying he was busy but I tried to point out that you could let your son know that he doesn't have to feel pressured into adding every little detail when those details aren't the other's person's business.

That's what I got from you post! It was clear and as the others, helpful. We had a good, long talk last night as he was going to bed and we pretty much settled that he could say "I'm busy now, but how about another day?" or something to that effect. He feels pretty good about that now.

And yes.... I was hoping for the big CA quake to hit right at that moment and swallow me up! I was tempted to try to explain but thought I would just make it worse. I'm the queen of subject changing.... and how is the weather where you are???:D

K