Teachers! Want to lend a hand?

[Chefzhat]

Lend a hand to a poor TA who is losing her mind?? :)

Here's my problem: I have 90 students a day over the period of 3 hours. Most of my classes are going great, but I have one class who just WON'T SHUT UP!!!! They talk all through class, all while I'm talking, you get the picture. I've got a grip on them so far, and it helps that I don't mind a noisy classroom. However, if I'm talking - no one should be talking.

Got any management tips for me?? Before I crack up??? I love 'em, but I don't want to hear them!!!! :p

TIA!
Debie
(a very tired, headachy Debie)

[boisewinesnob]

Sorry Debie, no advice really, but you reminded me of something going on in a class I'm in.

I'm in a class which is made up of mostly ED majors and ED grad students. Only about 4 of us are non ED majors. About 5 of these current/future teachers TALK NONSTOP while the prof or other classmates are talking (during class discussions).
I always shake my head and think, "wow, I hope they don't expect their own students to pay attention when THEY are teaching, seeing as they apparently think it's ok to talk all the time" :rolleyes:

[stacy7272]

I'm not a teacher but I used to do training for the company I worked for. I complained of this issue (yes, about adults!) to my boss and he gave me this tip: keep on talking and teaching but walk over to the offender(s) and stand next to them - maybe even lean on their desk(s). Being so close to them and having all eyes in their direction may shut them up and you haven't had to say anything to them or stop your instruction.

[Peggy]

What age group/grade are we talking about?

Peggy

[Chefzhat]

Peggy, 7th grade.

Stacey, I'm using that tip - it's called "camping". It's pretty effective, except that I have so many kids (and the desks are all in rows) that if I'm "camping" in one location, the other location is gabbing! I don't think I can change the rows around so that I have better control - not my room.

Boise - I know what you mean. You should sit in on my Ed seminar classes - the students gab nonstop. And they are training to be teachers!!!! Frustrating.

Debie

[helios7]

I definitely don't do 7th graders (I'm an early childhood kinda gal) but I thought of a couple things you may or may not have tried.

This works really well with early childhood ages- but have you tried positive reinforcement. Find SOMEONE doing approximately the right thing, and praise them for it. "Wow, I see X has their folder out and is ready to go." In Early Childhood that would result in a flurry of other children getting ready to go - 7th grade? I don't know.

The other thing I was wondering is just waiting them out. Standing at the front, arms crossed and waiting until they wonder when you'll start to get their attention. Then begin.

I don't know how much you want to invest in this, but there is a fantastic book that I'm using as a text for Classroom Management and Discipline for Children with Special Needs this semester. Its called Teaching Children to Care by Ruth Sidney Charney. Its for K-8, and while the techniques described seem a bit "impractical" (in terms of curriculum etc) at time, there's a great chapter on goals. She recommends having the students think about their goal for the year, and collaborate with parents and teachers to come up with a contract. Might be something to consider, because then you can refer to the talking behavior as "is this helping you meet your goal?"

Just some ideas ...

[Gecko]

I don't have any teaching experience but my first thought was that since they love to talk maybe they should stand up and try teaching the class :D . You could give the offenders one night to do their lesson plan and then let them see what it is like to try to be in the teachers shoes. Bet they wouldn't last long.

[Cookin4Love]

I teach 7th grade, too, and I feel your pain. My most effective strategy--believe it or not--is to simply stop talking when anyone else is talking. I literally stop mid-sentence, mid-word, or whatever and just put a blank look on my face, relax my shoulders and my jaw, and just stare at the wall in the back of the room. You'd think it would have the oppositive effect, but it shuts them up immediately. If you really want to get to them, keep it up for a full minute after they've all stopped talking. I don't know why it works--it just does.

Also, you can try the mystery student approach, since 7th graders don't like to be singled out. "Today's mystery student is listening quietly right now." "Today's mystery student is interrupting me right now."

Sometimes I grab a handful of Jolly Ranchers (8-10) and give them out to the few kids I see who are listening quietly/participating correctly. I just put them on their desk and say, "Thank you for making my job easy by being polite."

Other times, I just explain to them that it's distracting to me when they talk, and I can't continue to assist them and instruct them if they don't knock it off. I also tell them that I was going to give them some time to work with a partner on the assignment, but if they're going to use the time to talk now, they won't get that time later.

None of those things work every time, and they're not "official" techniques, but one or the other (or a combination) usually gets the job done.

Are you familiar with Fred Jones's Positive Classroom Management and the PAT time concept? That works really well with some groups, and doesn't work at all with others.

[mbrogier]

Sometimes I grab a handful of Jolly Ranchers (8-10) and give them out to the few kids I see who are listening quietly/participating correctly. I just put them on their desk and say, "Thank you for making my job easy by being polite."


You can also bean the really loud ones in the head with the candies. :D

(sorry, not a teacher, so I can't help) Just wanted to give you a laugh and a hug. :)

(((Debbie)))

[vbak]

I truly feel your pain! I am a sp, ed, teacher and last year I had 5 of the 6 most poorly behaved boys in the school iin my room for 2 class periods. One talked out 52 times in a 43 minute class period. :( I tried using stickies to earn 5 minutes of free time at the end of the period and it worked for awhile. I used camping, the silent treatment , and lunch detention and those worked for awhile, too. My principal even put a video camera in the room. Their behavior hasn't changed this year as I see them in the hall or the office daily. A few years ago one of my students was expelled for his behavior. As I was figuring grades after he left, guess what? Everyone's grades had gone up :) Imagine that. Hugs to you. I wish I had a magic wand to give to you.

Vicky

[honeygirl1971]

I teach college students and grad students who tend to be better behaved, but there are some who talk when I am talking sometimes and I do what Cooking4Love said, I just stop talking and look at them until they stop. One summer a few years ago I taught reading classes to kids of all ages and some of the classes were 7-8th graders, and this technique worked with them too. If there was a ringleader who consistently talked when I was talking (or refused to do what he/she was told) then I sent the person out into the hall, finished what I was saying to the rest of the class, then went out into the hall to discuss the issue with the student one one one. It sounds basic, but it always worked. If it's a matter of a bunch of students talking, I think Cooking4Love is right, you've probably got to try a bunch of techniques--no one thing will work with every group. But in the college classes I've noticed that a lot depends on the seriousness of my attitude--if FROM DAY ONE I take this issue seriously and do the silent treatment, I don't have any problems after the first day or two. But trying to get them to change bad habits one they are entrenched is difficult!

[Cookin4Love]

You can also bean the really loud ones in the head with the candies. :D


This made me laugh, because it reminded me of an incident a couple of years ago. I had a student intern at the time, and he had asked me about the bowl of rocks I keep on my desk. Actually, they're porous rocks on which I'd poured scented oil to make at least the area around my desk smell better. Of course, being the smart a$$ junior high teacher I am, and assuming he would know I was only kidding, I said, "Oh, I keep them there so I have something to bean a kid with when they're misbehaving." You guessed it. Later that day, some kid wouldn't stop talking, and a rock went flying across the room from my desk and caught him right in the head. I couldn't believe it (although it was kind of funny). Luckily, the rocks are very light weight--not much heavier than a ping pong ball, so the kid wasn't hurt. I learned that my junior high kids aren't the only ones who take things too literally sometimes!

Sorry for the hijack--back to your regularly scheduled thread.

[badunnin]

Debie - I have some pointers from last year, but will have to type them up later. How is your administration? Cooperative if you send a few kids down once in a while?

[eas11]

Debie,
Depending on the maturity of this particular class, you might have a discussion with them at the beginning of a class to define and brainstorm the problem. Let them know how disruptive it is and what do they think is a solution?
In my experience, the worst time to deal with problem behaviors is while they are happening. Sure, you need to get through those moments with whatever strat works then, like camping, but immediate interventions may not provide ongoing or long term solutions- those often come well after the storm when everyone can talk rationally about a problem.

Since you said you cannot effect some enviornmental controls because it's not your room, that makes me wonder about a few things, since the configuration seems acceptable for others-
Are the kids behaving for the other teachers and not giving you the respect you deserve?
Are the other teachers more accepting of the chatter, or simply don't care?
What has your Mentor/Cooperating teacher suggested?

[Chefzhat]

Okay, I'm back. Whew - long, but good day.

Here's what I did: had a classroom meeting with both classes. Explained that I had a lot of things to do with them during my time there and I was excited to be able to share it with them. I had some fun things planned, good discussions, etc. I told them that I would put these numbers on the board: 4 3 2 1. If I had to quiet them while I was talking I was simply going to erase a number, the numbers left meant that they could have that time to socialize at the end of the hour (max 4 minutes).

Third hour kept all their minutes and we had a great class. Fourth hour (the more rambunctious one) lost two minutes right away, then another one 5 minutes later, their last minute within 10 minutes of the end of class. By that time they were policing themselves (shh-ing each other). I'm thinking that tomorrow will be better. Best of all, I didn't have to stand there and say "quiet", I just erased a number, and stood there waiting patiently.

Ellen, who says the configuration is acceptable to others? My CT just doesn't want to change the room around. She has no suggestions for me, except to say "good luck" - this group of kids is a tough group. Suffice it say, she really needs to retire. :(

Thanks for everyone's input, and would be willing to hear anything else. I need all the tricks I can to manage this (and any future classes).

xo
Debie

[eas11]

[QUOTE=Chefzhat]Okay, I'm back. Whew - long, but good day.

Here's what I did: had a classroom meeting with both classes. Explained that I had a lot of things to do with them during my time there and I was excited to be able to share it with them. I had some fun things planned, good discussions, etc. I told them that I would put these numbers on the board: 4 3 2 1. If I had to quiet them while I was talking I was simply going to erase a number, the numbers left meant that they could have that time to socialize at the end of the hour (max 4 minutes).

Excellent! You get an A+ for this plan :D , called a "response cost" in ABA terms. The only problem you may have with it moving forward is that if a class loses all its numbers early on in class, theres little motivation to continue the "good" behavior since they've already blown their reward. A solution for that is to reserve some ability to earn minute(s) for the last 10 minutes or so of class, if you know what I mean. Hope that makes sense.

Third hour kept all their minutes and we had a great class. Fourth hour (the more rambunctious one) lost two minutes right away, then another one 5 minutes later, their last minute within 10 minutes of the end of class. By that time they were policing themselves (shh-ing each other). I'm thinking that tomorrow will be better. Best of all, I didn't have to stand there and say "quiet", I just erased a number, and stood there waiting patiently.

Ellen, who says the configuration is acceptable to others? My CT just doesn't want to change the room around. She has no suggestions for me, except to say "good luck" - this group of kids is a tough group. Suffice it say, she really needs to retire. :(

Ugggh. Makes it really hard for those of us who are motivated while others are playing the retirement waiting game. So unfair to the kids. :mad:

[Chefzhat]

Ellen, I agree with you. I'm learning more about bad teachers than I want to this semester. Grrr.

[Beth]

Ellen, I agree with you. I'm learning more about bad teachers than I want to this semester. Grrr.

Hang in there....those lessons are very important too.

I like your approach. I was reading with interest and no teaching experience, just mom experience and watching different techniques teachers or scout leaders have used.

One of my son's teachers last year would give students a warning, but the next time they were required to write an essay of length in pages equal to the number of the day of the month. Kids could relax a little at the beginning of the month, but the rest of the month was pretty quiet. I wasn't particularly enamoured with that one, but with more holidays occurring in the mid to later part of the month, I imagine that it helped curb some of that excitement in the classroom. ;)

[Escher]

Also, you can try the mystery student approach, since 7th graders don't like to be singled out. "Today's mystery student is listening quietly right now." "Today's mystery student is interrupting me right now."

Lots of neat ideas here.

I wish I could say that was one of them, but I can't.

Sorry, it's weak.


Anyone see the Little House on the Prarie re-run on TVLand last night? It made me think of this thread....

Yes, I watch LHOTP regularly. But don't tell anyone else.