"Veggies as Good as Dessert?" Just curious about what folks think

[makedah]

This article applies more to people with really unhealthful diets than most of us here, but I'd be interested to know what folks thought of this article. It is from the Prevention (magazine) Web site.

Veggies as Good as Dessert http://www.prevention.com/report/010301veggies/

Start making vegetables so luscious you can't resist them. This old-fashioned secret could save your life Adam Drewnowski, Ph.D., has a revolutionary idea: He thinks you ought to add butter, sugar and salt to your veggies -- and that you'll probably live longer as a result.

Dr. Drewnowski, who heads the nutritional sciences program at the University of Washington in Seattle, says that dietitians and cancer experts have been telling us for years to eat vegetables plain (either steamed or raw) for maximum goodness.

"But I say absolutely not," says Dr. Drewnowski. That's because his research has revealed that many of the cancer-fighting compounds in vegetables taste -- well, not so
hot if we eat them plain.

But it gets worse. "When I read the research on phytochemicals, no one even talks about
the fact that these compounds are bitter, bitter, bitter," he says. He's documented
glucosinolates in broccoli, sinigrin in brussels sprouts, cyanogenic glycosides in lima beans, and dozens of other compounds that probably help us fight cancer (plus heart disease, high blood pressure and stroke, diabetes, and cataracts) but that just plain turns us off. No wonder only about 25 percent of Americans eat even the minimum five servings of fruits and vegetables a day.

Rediscover cheese sauce
Dr. Drewnowski's answer for that dilemma? Rediscover and put into practice the magic secrets that good cooks have known for
centuries. Old-fashioned veggie cooks learned
long ago to use butter, olive oil, sugar and salt to mask and mellow those bitter phytochemical flavors. And Dr. Drewnowski says that food scientists are now starting to document what cooks have always known. At a recent conference in Japan, scientists presented a paper showing that sphingolipids and phospolipids in milk fat could mask
bitter tastes. "I thought, oh well, that's interesting. They've rediscovered cheese sauce," he says.

Dr. Drewnowski feels that we'll lose the veggie battle if we ask people to eat plain
veggies for a health payoff 50 years down the road. "People are motivated by what they enjoy, so if you offer them raw spinach or chocolate cake, they'll take chocolate cake. But chocolate cake versus spinach cooked with butter and cheese -- now that's a contest!"

Can you go overboard, getting too many calories and more fat than is healthy by making veggies as good as dessert? Dr. Drewnowski says no, as long as you make veggies the main focus of your meal. A big with olive oil and glazed carrots will still be lower in calories than a big cheeseburger and fries -- and far better for you.

[This message has been edited by makedah (edited 06-11-2001).]

[Julia1Pin]

My first thought - This man is an idiot!

What he says is probably true to some extent - "make it taste better, and people will eat it" - it doesn't take a genius to figure it out! But this is going to give people carte blanche to eat very un-healthy. How about tell people, that if you cook veggies ion interesting ways, like in a minnestrone, or even in (my favorite new recipe) easy Asian Beef and Noodles, you can get your servings on vegetables and have them taste good.

Smothering anything in butter or cream cancels out the benefits of the vegetable, IMHO.

Also, how about the recent article that says that obesity is worse than smoking? Is this article says that obesity is better than not eating vegetables?

Argh.... Ok, breathe, breathe...

[aggie94]

I completely agree with Julia. Am I so out of the ordinary to think that vegetables drowned in butter and cream DON'T taste good? I love the simplicity of a side dish of steamed veggies, or a spinach salad, especially if my main meal is complex and flavorful. I am skeptical that Americans would somehow miraculously start eating their five servings of fruits & veggies a day if you throw cheese on them. It's a bigger problem than just flavor, IMO.

[SQ]

Oh my!! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/redface.gif I can't quite agree w/his (wisdom?!?)

[SQ]

Originally posted by aggie94:
Am I so out of the ordinary to think that vegetables drowned in butter and cream DON'T taste good?

I agree with you. Butter, cream, salt and sugar would ruin veggies for me, too.

[mandarin2j]

Someone posted awhile back that the average person consumes an inordinate amount of fat when he/she uses globs of salad dressing on their "healthy lunch." We shouldn't have to pinch our noses to gag down veggies we don't like, but we should also be realistic about what it takes to make us like veggies.

For people who generally don't care for veggies, there has to be a happy medium between forcing themselves to eat raw, unadorned veggies and dressing veggies with so much fat that they can't even taste them. I hate brussels sprouts, and I could probably gag them down with some cheese sauce, but why do that when there are so many other choices out there of veggies I do like? I used to love asparagus with Hollandaise sauce, but who needs the cholesterol? I stopped eating asparagus altogether until I found an alternative preparation-roasting in a trace of olive oil-that I adore.

Remember the health-related ad campaigns that ran during cartoons in the late '70s? There was "yuck mouth" about dental hygiene, and "hanker for a hunka cheese" about healthy snacking, and my fave "don't drown your food." Sing along, now: "Don't drown your food/in mayo or ketchup or goop/it's no fun to eat what you can't even see/so don't drown your food!" What a junkyard of memories I maintain! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/wink.gif

[SandyM]

Originally posted by mandarin2j:
Remember the health-related ad campaigns that ran during cartoons in the late '70s? There was "yuck mouth" about dental hygiene, and "hanker for a hunka cheese" about healthy snacking, and my fave "don't drown your food." Sing along, now: "Don't drown your food/in mayo or ketchup or goop/it's no fun to eat what you can't even see/so don't drown your food!" What a junkyard of memories I maintain! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/wink.gif

You and me both, girl - you and me both.

"I'm brushing my teeth la deeee! I'm brushing my teeth la daaaaa!" (big ugly bird or some unknown creature eating an apple).

Thank you for the memories!!! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/biggrin.gif

[maizeyoats]

Some of the recipes on that link sound pretty good to me and they don't seem seem outrageously fatty

[KValley]

My first reaction after reading this was to wonder how much culture plays into this taste for sweets and fats? In many Asian countries, sweets are not part of the diet- breakfasts are savory dishes of soup, noodles, fish. I'm thinking of red bean paste in Japan, which serves as the filling for pastries and has the taste and consistency of whipped modeling clay- it's not even as good as PlayDoh (sorry, my HO- otherwise I adore Japanese food.) But the taste is sweet to them, because they haven't been raised on fruit juices in their bottles, Sugar Smacks for breakfast, candy as a reward.

The same would be true of animals fats in cheese and butter. I suppose in European countries, where these are widely eaten, the issue is portion control.

I am one of those annoying "dressing on the side" people- I hate my salad and veggies to to arrive drenched in butter or dressing.

Generally, I think this notion is silly. I agree with Eva- I don't think throwing cheese on brussel sprouts is going to cause a revolution in vegetable consumption. People are just plain lazy. There are so many ways to make vegetable delicious.

[lorilei]

Thank you maizeyoats.

I think the issue here is getting veggies to /taste/ good to a non-veggie lover. Not necessarily "drowning" them in fat.

Everyone should ENJOY eating. No one should eat healthy simply because they /should/... these are the kinds of attitudes that make dullards of us all.


[This message has been edited by lorilei (edited 06-11-2001).]

[BlueMoose]

I don't see a problem with adding a SMALL amount of butter, sour cream, cheese, etc to veggies. The key is MODERATION. But so many people seem to have trouble with that. Sometimes I enjoy adding a tablespoon of sour cream to my baked potato or on top of a burrito...but how many people stop at that? I also will add just a little bit of butter to veggies so my daughter will eat them, but VERY little. There are lots of ways to incorporate vegetables into meals besides just eating them as a plain side dish or covering them with cheese sauce and butter. OK, none of this is making any sense because I am beyond tired http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/eek.gif .

[Ohioan]

String beans "bitter"? Broccoli "bitter"? Asparagus "bitter"? Huh???

Either this man has something seriously wrong with his tasting equipment or someone's been selling him questionable produce.

Actually, he's probably eaten too much glop all his life, until he can't even detect the taste of anything other than the glop, let alone appreciate it. The same thing happens to people who've oversalted their food for a long time. If the only thing that'll make vegetables "luscious" to him is to hide their taste behind other tastes, he should hardly be counseling other people on what and how to eat. I suggest he get a tastebud transplant and try again.

Sorry, folks, but this is exactly the kind of thing that makes my teeth grind (and after getting a brand new crown, too! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/frown.gif) I'll say -- or yell -- it once more: VEGETABLES AND FRUITS AREN'T JUST GOOD FOR YOU BUT GOOD TO EAT.

Grrrr,
Phoebe
The Beans-and-Greens Queen
and Fruity One

[kwormann]

WHat about a happy medium.....balsamic vinegar or your broccoli, a spritz of olive oil and lemon on your asparagus, a dash of salt and pepper on your tomato...those are some of my favorite food! I was salavating this month when I saw the recipe and picture in CL of the yellow and green bean casserole with fresh tomato dressing, fresh basil and a touch of feta.....pure poetry!

(So glad to see my motivation (Phoebe) returning......)
Kim

[BlueMoose]

I agree with Phoebe...I don't find vegetables bitter at all. Did anyone read the sweet potato recipe? He added almost 1 cup of sugar to (i think) 3 lbs of sweet potaoes! I eat veggies and fruits because I like them, and I just don't eat the few that I don't like (eggplant...yuck!).

[sneezles]

I have been debating as to whether or not to respond to this thread. Everyone who has posted here has given their thoughts regarding how they feel about veggies. I keep thinking about it as a parent and how difficult it can be to get children to eat or even taste a veggie!
Of the three boys I have had the pleasure to raise, only one would eat every and any veggie served. The other two needed help. And some veggies do taste bitter to some people. Honey and brown sugar (and I'm talking about a tbs of each) added to carrots. Sesame oil and soy sauce to broccoli or asparagus. Enhancement though not disguising the veggie. One still chooses not to eat most veggies and I leave it up to him to choose because food will never be an issue between us. And I hope that some day his tastes will change but maybe they won't.

[SusanT]

I don't see the harm in a little butter or olive oil on vegetables. And yes, asparagus, broccoli and other vegetables can taste bitter. Children's taste buds are much more sensitive to bitter flavors than adults which is why a lot of kids (and some adults) don't like broccoli.

When considering that the most eaten vegetable in America are french fried potatoes, a little pat of butter on peas seems like a decent compromise.

[joyous]

Veggies bitter? Absolutely, to some people, and not just children. The taste perception of foods varies from person to person. When you bite into Brussels sprouts, don't assume that I'm experiencing exactly the same flavor.

I perceive many vegetables as bitter. Lately, I've been trying to improve my overall health, which has meant greatly increasing the number of veggies that I eat. But you will NOT catch me eating plain steamed vegetables.--with or without a bit of salt and pepper, or a light drizzle of olive oil.

Moderation is good. I'm not advocating eating cheese sauce with a piece of zucchini in there somewhere. But if it's a choice between broccoli with a couple of spoons of cheese sauce, or no vegetable at all, I've got to think that broccoli/cheese is the better way to go.

[joyous]

Veggies bitter? Absolutely, to some people, and not just children. The taste perception of foods varies from person to person. When you bite into Brussels sprouts, don't assume that I'm experiencing exactly the same flavor.

I perceive many vegetables as bitter. Lately, I've been trying to improve my overall health, which has meant greatly increasing the number of veggies that I eat. But you will NOT catch me eating plain steamed vegetables.--with or without a bit of salt and pepper, or a light drizzle of olive oil.

Moderation is good. I'm not advocating eating cheese sauce with a piece of zucchini in there somewhere. But if it's a choice between broccoli with a couple of spoons of cheese sauce, or no vegetable at all, I've got to think that broccoli/cheese is the better way to go.

[makedah]

Originally posted by mandarin2j:
Remember the health-related ad campaigns that ran during cartoons in the late '70s? There was "yuck mouth" about dental hygiene, and "hanker for a hunka cheese" about healthy snacking, and my fave "don't drown your food." Sing along, now: "Don't drown your food/in mayo or ketchup or goop/it's no fun to eat what you can't even see/so don't drown your food!" What a junkyard of memories I maintain! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/wink.gif

"They call me 'Yuck Mouth,' 'cuz I don't brush!" I remember that "don't drown your food" one -- wasn't there a poor egg getting deluged with salad dressing or something?

What fun! I vaguely remember one of those ads about beans and rice, too. There was one about eating potatoes (and maybe other veggies) with the skin on. At the end, the song goes: "Hey Mom, give me some skiiiinnnn!" And the mother flips a baked potato onto her kid's plate.

And don't forget the 50's 'greaser' style one promoting eating crisp veggies: "Exercise those choppers really chew, chew, chew. Exercise those choppers on some good hard food."

Gosh, I guess those ads went out of vogue just as Happy Meals conquered the world.

[elnant]

Originally posted by mandarin2j:
Remember the health-related ad campaigns that ran during cartoons in the late '70s? There was "yuck mouth" about dental hygiene, and "hanker for a hunka cheese" about healthy snacking, and my fave "don't drown your food." Sing along, now: "Don't drown your food/in mayo or ketchup or goop/it's no fun to eat what you can't even see/so don't drown your food!" What a junkyard of memories I maintain! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/wink.gif

Wow, mandarin2j.. I was reading the above posts, and that song just popped into my head, too!!! I remember watching those on Saturday mornings! http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/smile.gif

[Anne]

This topic reminds me of the hot debate in our local grade school about including chocolate milk as an option to whole milk and low fat milk. Some parents objected to having the 'junk food' option and others said that chocolate milk was better than no milk. I like plain veges for themselves but maybe sauced veges are better than no veges? There have been times in my life when I was just happy to have food. Now I'm a bit picky and like to eat organically grown food. This issue seems to be a matter of experience, choice, opinion, taste, etc. Agriculture researchers are currently trying to breed (or GMF) vegetables to taste sweeter.

[Joyce]

I too have been hesitant to add to this thread. If one feels vegetables are wonderful steamed, with nothing else, why not eat meat grilled or broiled with nothing else, and rice or potatoes the same healthy way...there is no need for any of C/L's wonderful casserole recipes with sour cream, margarine, spices, etc. Also, why assume that non C/L readers would not use low fat sour cream, cheese, margarine, etc. Are we the only ones with this secret info???

[Ohioan]

I think the key word in the original article is "mask." The man is talking about "masking" flavors, not enhancing them. I, too, garnish or "enhance" vegetable flavors with a clove of garlic in the steaming water, a bit of dill thrown into my string beans, tarragon in my carrots, some olive oil and rosemary on my roasted root vegetables, a drop or two of sesame oil on roasted asparagus, and so on. But that's to enhance the flavors, not to mask them. The man who wrote the article quite obviously doesn't like vegetables at all.

Oh, and "cheese sauce" isn't the same as a sprinkling of grated or shredded cheese. It's a thick concoction of more than just cheese, and it's usually the primary flavor in a dish, to which the contents of the sauce serve as accents.

If I didn't like beans (gasp!) http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/eek.gif , I wouldn't set myself up as an expert on how to get people to eat beans by disguising them as something else -- especially something people shouldn't be eating too much of anyway. ("Try kidney beans smothered in marshmallow sauce with chocolate syrup -- you'll never know they're beans!" http://www.cookinglight.com/bbs/tongue.gif)

Holding the veggie banner high,
Phoebe

[Tina_B]

I love variety in my diet, and veggies are at the top of the list. Sometimes I eat them plain, other times I enjoy some additions.I think the author's comments do not apply to the majority of people who participate on this board. Less health concious people are not getting the benefit of the important nutrients and vitamins if they neglet veggies. Perhaps a sacrifice needs to to made, because one could argue that the benefits of vegetables outweigh the risks of additional fat and calories. I truly believe a healthy diet is one of moderation.

[BlueMoose]

This thread reminds me of being at my in-laws several years ago for Christmas. We were all being deprived of fresh fruits and vegetables. Behind my MIL's back (of course) her kids were taking bets as to who was going to find the piece of broccoli in the broccoli casserole!