Does extract count as alcohol?

[EllenL]

We're having friends over for dinner who won't/can't have alcohol in food. When I asked if it was okay in baked stuff since it would bake out, like bourbon in a pecan pie, they said it wouldn't be. So do you think a teaspoon or so of vanilla extract is off limits? It just seems like even though it may be about 30% alcohol, it would just be a drop in each chocolate mousse or slice of cake, etc.?

[Robyn1007]

Well, it depends on the reasons why they can't have it. Is it an allergy? A moral choice? Alcoholism issues? Do you have any vanilla beans or paste that you could sub in?

[lizzieb75]

Is it an issue of taste or something more personal? I think it depends on the reason why the person won't/can't.

[Jazzmatazz49]

I knew a woman who would not use vanilla extract because it had alcohol in it, moral reasons. I can't for the life of me remember what she used instead, but it must not have had alcohol in it.

[Canice]

I agree with the others that it would depend on the reason: an allergy or strict rejection of consuming alcohol in any manner would put it off limits. (Though I remember once having dinner in a restaurant with a mormon family and the 9 year daughter chastised the dad for using Dijon mustard, which he thought was OK.) Issues with alcoholism would not be a concern.

[Sugarbetty]

I cook with alcohol all the time and I am a mormon. I don't drink alcohol in cocktails or drinks, but I do cook with it at times. I don't think there is anything prohibiting this in the religion. Therefore, in that regard vanilla extract would not be a problem. But, I suppose like the other posters it depends on why they are abstaining.

[Robyn1007]

Issues with alcoholism would not be a concern.

I disagree. I once had a family member who had such serious issues that he absolutely could not eat anything made with alcohol so I wouldn't just make that assumption.

[PattiA]

Trader Joe's has an alcohol-free vanilla extract.

Regardless of the reason, if someone requests that I don't use alcohol, I don't use any alcohol, including alcohol-based extracts.

[EllenL]

Thanks for your replies. I have no idea why they don't want alcohol in anything. The woman goes to a support group, but I'm pretty sure it's an eating disorder group. They haven't said why and I don't have the nerve to ask...

I may check out the alcohol-free TJ's extract.

[clairea]

Thanks for your replies. I have no idea why they don't want alcohol in anything. The woman goes to a support group, but I'm pretty sure it's an eating disorder group. They haven't said why and I don't have the nerve to ask...

I may check out the alcohol-free TJ's extract.

It's not a matter of having the nerve to ask, you have the good manners not to ask. If they wanted you to know more details, they certainly would have shared them during the two conversations you have had about this issue. As you don't know the reason for the ban on alcohol, the safe thing to do is to not use any -- either try to find the alcohol-free substitute, or adjust your menu so it won't be an issue.

[Hammster]

That's an interesting take on what is good manners.

Honestly, there is no reason you couldn't call and say you are making something that has vanilla extract in it and you know they have some reason for no alcohol (based on your previous conversations) and if it's ok to use the vanilla extract. You don't have to ask why they don't drink alcohol or want alcohol, but it would be nice to know if vanilla extract is ok to use.

[lindrusso]

Good thing I'm not cooking for them - I would have baked with vanilla extract without a second thought. Not because I would be deliberately discounting their request, but because I never think of vanilla extract as having alcohol - it's just another baking ingredient. I probably wouldn't have caught it!

[swedish cook]

Can you possibly find vanilla sugar in Atlanta? It's sold in some specialty food stores. That's what Germans and Swedes use in baking.
1 tsp. vanilla extract = 2 tsp. vanilla sugar

I once had to call CL asking for substitute for red wine. They suggested apple cider. Tasted differently but was OK.

[Linda in MO]

Good thing I'm not cooking for them - I would have baked with vanilla extract without a second thought. Not because I would be deliberately discounting their request, but because I never think of vanilla extract as having alcohol - it's just another baking ingredient. I probably wouldn't have caught it!

That's what I was thinking. I just don't think it ever would have crossed my mind.

[funniegrrl]

I agree with Hammster -- I don't see why you can't call and ask. You don't ask about their reasons for abstaining from alcohol, you just say, "I wanted to double-check ... can you have vanilla or other extracts in baked goods, or should I avoid those as well?" That's not prying or being rude, that's a simple request for clarification so you can abide by their wishes. You want a yes/no on the extract, not a treatise on their philosophy so you can figure out the extract question on your own.

[ADM]

If someone asked you, "Please, serve NO nuts!" You wouldn't call them and ask if you could add *just a bit* of Hazelnut liqueur to a recipe, would you?

I, and everyone else, must assume they said just exactly what they meant to say! If they didn't mean that, the substitution of vanilla sugar won't hurt, or inconvenience, anyone much, will it? Actually, as previously posted, vanilla sugar sounds like the perfect solution!

[sneezles]

If someone asked you, "Please, serve NO nuts!" You wouldn't call them and ask if you could add *just a bit* of Hazelnut liqueur to a recipe, would you?

Not the point, there are some who've posted that using an extract is so common that thinking of it as alcohol doesn't even enter the picture. So while they wouldn't ask if they could use a liqueur it wouldn't cross their minds that an extract would be a concern. The vanilla sugar is a good sub but so would just using the bean.

[tamawrite]

Add me to the list of people who wouldn't have thought about extracts containing alcohol. I don't think it would be rude to ask whether vanilla extract is ok.

[Kjente2]

We're having friends over for dinner who won't/can't have alcohol in food. When I asked if it was okay in baked stuff since it would bake out, like bourbon in a pecan pie, they said it wouldn't be. So do you think a teaspoon or so of vanilla extract is off limits? It just seems like even though it may be about 30% alcohol, it would just be a drop in each chocolate mousse or slice of cake, etc.?

You need to know that alcohol does not totally cook out. The longer and the wider the opening of the pot, the more that evaporates, but there will always be a percentage remaining. I got a good buzz from a piece of pecan pie with bourbon in it. Extracts are about 35% alcohol.
That said, the answer is whether it's an allergy, an addiction, or a moral issue.
http://homecooking.about.com/library...lalcohol12.htm

[ADM]

Not the point, there are some who've posted that using an extract is so common that thinking of it as alcohol doesn't even enter the picture. . . It wouldn't cross their minds that an extract would be a concern

You said it absolutely right! That is the whole point of the discussion, isn't it? It is only the persons who do remember, that are the ones who worry about the rudeness of asking.

(I had an entirely different reason for mentioning the no nuts issue.)

[Hammster]

If someone asked you, "Please, serve NO nuts!" You wouldn't call them and ask if you could add *just a bit* of Hazelnut liqueur to a recipe, would you?

I, and everyone else, must assume they said just exactly what they meant to say! If they didn't mean that, the substitution of vanilla sugar won't hurt, or inconvenience, anyone much, will it? Actually, as previously posted, vanilla sugar sounds like the perfect solution!

As mentioned already most never even consider vanilla extract as an alcohol source. It's very thoughtful and considerate that EllenL is wondering about it.

Also, no one has to assume anything. It's easy enough to make a 5 minute phone call, ask about vanilla extract and maybe even not have to go to the store to buy an ingredient that may only get used this one time. I've seen plenty of threads on the bb about what to do with a leftover ingredient that someone bought for one recipe and now doesn't know what to do with the rest of the ingredient.

Also, DW's brother is a recovering alcoholic and drug addict and he doesn't have a problem with vanilla extract at all. How do we know? We asked. It is totally fine to ask if vanilla extract is ok to use without having to know why someone doesn't normally drink or eat things with alcohol. Who knows, the person might not even realise that vanilla extract has alcohol in it and enjoys many things made with vanilla.

I'm thinking Ellen's friend will be very appreciative of the thoughtfullness of a phone call to see if the extract is ok to use.

[Canice]

You need to know that alcohol does not totally cook out. The longer and the wider the opening of the pot, the more that evaporates, but there will always be a percentage remaining. I got a good buzz from a piece of pecan pie with bourbon in it. Extracts are about 35% alcohol.
That said, the answer is whether it's an allergy, an addiction, or a moral issue.
http://homecooking.about.com/library...lalcohol12.htm

Still seems to all go back to the recipe and the REASON. Strong alcohol as in a bourbon pecan pie is one thing, and I can see that being inappropriate to serve to a sober alcoholic, and yes, we all know that alcohol does not 100% cook out of food, but to claim that a teaspoon of vanilla extract in a batch of brownies is the slippery slope to a "slip" for an alcoholic is just preposterous. I've known and been close to a number of sober alcoholics since I was a teenager, and have never EVER heard that that there was a real or imagined risk in eating a brownie that contained a teaspoon of vanilla extract in the dough. The chemistry of that doesn't even make sense, but if there's a psychological reason to honor it, by all means do so. But a recovering alcoholic is not going have a slip by eating a Mrs. Field's cookie if it contains vanilla extract.

[clairea]

The OP said she "didn't have the nerve to ask" why the guests don't drink alcohol, and my comment regarding manners was related to that. I don't think it would be rude to call and ask if vanilla extract is ok, if that is the question to be asked.

However, in this instance I would not personally call and ask about the vanilla, I would just find a substitute -- the issue has already been called to attention twice in conversation and it sounds like it is not something that the guests want to discuss at length. It is not a tremendous inconvenience to make another recipe or to substitute for the vanilla, and I would rather do that than risk making my guests uncomfortable by continuing to ask them about a sensitive issue.

[schuh]

Add me to the list of people who wouldn't even have thought about vanilla extract as being a source of alcohol. But since you thought of it, I wouldn't call and ask them about it again. I'm sure you can find something to serve that doesn't call for an extract.

FWIW, I have an uncle who does not consume alcohol for moral reasons. He also doesn't eat things with booze in them because he doesn't want to support the liquor trade in any way. But I'd bet you money that even his wife, who is an avid baker, uses regular vanilla extract in her baking.

[katygirl]

My sister who is an alcoholic was on a medicine (pill form) that she would take daily (I forget the name of the pill.) The reason for the pill is to purposely make the person violently ill if she consumes alcohol. It is supposed to be a deterent for a "spur of the moment relapse" Anyway, when she was on this pill she had to be very very careful that she avoided ANYTHING with alcohol in it, she even had to check the labels of her face cream, hair products etc.

I would ask if she can have vanilla extract and leave it at that rather than asking WHY she can't.

[hollysmom]

. I got a good buzz from a piece of pecan pie with bourbon in it.

Did you get the recipe? I think it would be yummy!

Sounds like my dad's rum-soaked fruitcake (personally, the only way to eat one)

SSM